056 - Turning Trials Into Triumph in Birth (with Emilie Cubino)

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SHOW NOTES:

As a first time mom, sometimes you just don’t know what you don’t know. And Emilie didn’t know she was being induced, or why. But that wasn’t all. She also got the one doctor she definitely didn’t want, and what he said during her labor will shock you (or maybe not, if you’re familiar with how some surgically minded OB’s can be). Then, as she was planning her peaceful second birth at home, everything changed last minute, and not only did she end up moving multiple states away, but tragedy struck, and she had to be without her husband during delivery. What amazes me about Emilie was her ability to see the positive in the situation, to see God’s grace and His blessings He gave her throughout the journey. 

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TRANSCRIPT:

056 - Emilie Cubino

Emilie: [00:00:00] When I got there, I was really frustrated with the nurse that walked me to my room because there was a lady in labor in the room next to mine and the nurse was like, oh, she was a home birth transfer and I don't know why she was transferred. Obviously they didn't tell me that. Mm-Hmm . But I was like, oh, okay, cool.

Like I was supposed to have a home birth and the nurse looks at me, she's like, well, I'm glad that you're safe now.

Kayla: What?

I'm Kayla Heater, follower of Jesus wife and mother of five children. Christian childbirth educator and doula and your host of the Surrendered Birth Stories podcast, where we share God centered birth stories, evidence based birth education, and our pursuit of surrendering our birth plans to God. Let's get started.

Hey everyone, happy week. So glad you are here and listening. I am [00:01:00] recording this before I go out of town, but by the time you're listening to this I will be at the beach with my family and I am very excited. Although it does take a lot of prep work to get a family of seven. Out, um, to a beach, but, but I'm excited.

We actually have been super blessed with this opportunity, um, through an acquaintance, they are allowing us to stay in their incredibly amazing beach house for free, otherwise we honestly could not do it. So it's super, super exciting for us. And we just don't take that blessing for granted and we are pumped about it.

It's actually in the outer banks of North Carolina, all the way at the very, very top, um, past Corolla into Corova beach. And you actually have to, you have to drive the last 30 30 minutes on the sand to get to [00:02:00] the house because the road stops. So, which we experienced for the first time last year when this same really generous acquaintance let us stay there.

Um, so they offered it up again this year and my husband, super excited. He's an introvert, so he really likes You know, the more isolated private areas, which it very much is up there. So, you know, we get to see the horses and I don't know, there's like a pool and a hot tub. And it's just going to be really, really fun.

I'm excited. Although please, if you're listening to this, Please just take a second and pray the rain away, because it is forecasted to rain every single day while we are there. And not like an afternoon pop up storm, but like rain, rain, rain, rain, rain, like every day that we're there. So if you could please just pray.

Pray that rain away with me. I mean, I don't mind a day of rain or a couple of afternoons of rain, but all day, every [00:03:00] day is not exactly my idea of a good week at the beach. And this is the first time, you know, our family has been at the beach since last year. So it'll be Indy's first time at the beach.

And I don't know, I just, I don't know. It would, it would be nice if it didn't rain the whole time. Really, really, please, please don't let it rain the whole time. But okay, let's get into this week's episode. As a first time mom, or maybe even a second or third time mom, sometimes you just don't know what you don't know.

And Emily didn't know she was being induced. Or why. But that wasn't all. She also got the one doctor she definitely did not want. And what he said during her labor will shock you. Or maybe not shock you. Then. As she was planning her peaceful second birth at [00:04:00] home, everything changed last minute. And not only did she end up moving multiple states away, but tragedy struck and her husband couldn't be with her during delivery.

What amazes me about Emily was her ability to see the positive in the situation, to see God's grace and his blessings he gave her throughout the journey. And it's all together inspiring.

Welcome to another episode of Surrendered Birth Stories. I am your host, Kayla Heder, and I have Emily with me today. Emily, why don't you introduce yourself, um, tell us a little bit about you. Who you are, what your life is like, your family, et cetera. Let us get to know you.

Emilie: Sounds good. I'm really excited to be here.

Um, I am Emily and Kavino. I've been married to my husband for 10 years this past June. Um, we have two kids, Evelyn and Gabriel. [00:05:00] There's seven, almost seven and almost three. And we live in North Carolina. My husband works. Um, he used to be in the military and now he works in manufacturing and I work from home.

I've been a virtual assistant for about five years, but I currently work for an herbal wellness company from home. And then I homeschool my children. I love to read. We have a dog named Bella. We just took her to the beach for the first time and we're just enjoying being together as a family. That's our favorite thing to do is just spend time together.

Kayla: Oh, that's wonderful. How is it working from home and homeschooling? What does that look like for you?

Emilie: It's very difficult, and I'm not always great at it, honestly. Um, it was different when I was working, um, just as my own boss, and I had clients that I would help as a social media manager or virtual assistant.

That was a lot easier to do, definitely. Um, it's also a lot easier because I only had one kid at the time. Now I have two children and I work for a company now. And so my time is not always my own. So it's [00:06:00] a little, it is a little difficult and I fail a lot all the time at it. Um, just to be quite honest, it is very difficult, but I love homeschooling enough that our goal eventually is for me to not work for a company anymore and just work for myself again at some point.

Um, it's just, The economy is so hard right now that getting to that point is going to take a little bit. So yeah, I try to spend as much time with my kids as I can in the morning and then start work around 11. So when I homeschool, that morning time looks like just homeschooling. So

Kayla: yeah. I'm always interested to see how people pull off homeschooling.

We homeschool too. So um, I'm always like, how do you do that? How do you do that? What does that look like?

Emilie: I'm the same

Kayla: way. I'm Okay, well, let's talk about these beautiful children of yours, uh, starting with your first pregnancy. What was that like finding out you were pregnant? How did that go? Tell us, tell us that story.

Emilie: Yeah. Uh, so my [00:07:00] husband and I had been married for, we were married two years at the time when we decided that we wanted to get pregnant. Um, I had been off birth control for about a year at that point because it had made me crazy. Um, thankfully I had only been on it a year, so it was easier to come off and I didn't feel as like, Many withdrawal symptoms from it, but, um, we got pregnant right away.

Um, thankfully it was an easy process, um, for both of my children. Uh, but the first time I was very surprised at how quickly I get pregnant, I honestly expected a little bit more of a struggle, um, just cause I'd had some health issues in the year before that. But, um, we got married or not get married. We got pregnant and told our families at Thanksgiving.

And, um, it was like, we just, um, Kind of just stop preventing was what our plan was. We were just excited to, you know, not have to worry about things anymore. And so, um, told her families that Thanksgiving morning sickness hit me really, really hard the [00:08:00] first six weeks, especially, um, we, I ended up having a lot of gastrointestinal issues and on top of the morning sickness, and thankfully I was staying at home at that point.

I had just quit a job. Before I got pregnant and it had been so difficult on my health that my husband was like, just stay at home and it's okay, let's just rest. You need to recoup from the past two years of that job. So, um, thankfully I was able to rest, but with those gastrointestinal issues, by the time I was six weeks pregnant, it was, I was like, I just need to go to the emergency room.

I've had, I've been on the toilet a lot by that point. I don't want to have any gory details or anything, but I was using the restroom a lot. And, um, essentially we found out that. I, the baby essentially had caused my gut to be like needing more from me. So I had been fine prior to that, but babies take all of your nutrition and I essentially had not enough nutrition.

So I had to eat more fiber. I [00:09:00] needed to do like a whole 30 diet essentially to just give my body the amount of vegetables that needed at that point.

Kayla: Yeah,

Emilie: we were super broke. So I hadn't really been focusing on. Eating super healthy at that point. Yeah, it was just whatever we could afford. Um, so that kind of kicked me into gear.

We went on whole 30, that whole pregnancy, . Wow. We were so, we were so hungry, um, . So I don't honestly probably wouldn't recommend it to anyone who has like health issues. Um, it was, it worked for us. I think it definitely made a difference for nursing down the road. And I'll explain that with my why. I think that with my second.

Born, but, um, yeah, whole 30 was difficult while I was pregnant because I was so hungry the whole time.

Kayla: I believe it. That is, I, so it's funny because my husband and I just did whole 30 for the first time. Yes. But not for nine months, just for one month, um, just for the 30 days, he wanted to do like a little reset and I was like, I'll do it [00:10:00] with you because no big deal, whatever.

It was hard and I think for me, I'm, and I am nursing, like I'm nursing a giant baby. He's 21 pounds and he eats nonstop all day long. So I was like, I'm starving all the time. I'm so hungry. And so I, okay, I lasted 15 days. And then

Emilie: really good for nursing.

Kayla: But then I integrated, all I did was integrate like sourdough back in because I was like, I really just miss the sourdough and butter.

Like that's what I need. So I, oh, and, and raw milk, I should say that. So it was just like, okay, I'm going to do a whole 30 plus raw milk and sourdough. So I know it's not really whole 30. And I know that the real whole 30 champions out there would be like, that's not really, you didn't really do it. But. But my husband really did do it and I rallied with him and made his meals and, um, ate like he ate during his meals and stuff.

[00:11:00] So.

Emilie: That's still a really natural diet though. I mean, sourdough, but that's essentially what they would have eaten in the Bible was a sourdough type of bread

Kayla: and

Emilie: raw milk. And so that's pretty like unprocessed still.

Kayla: Yeah. I don't know if you're, sorry, we're getting off topic just for a hair here. Um, we, I have, there's this mill.

Have you heard of Lindley mills? Yes. In North Carolina. Yeah. Yes I'm going to start ordering

Emilie: from them soon.

Kayla: Yeah. So they have like all organic um, you know, fresh milled flour that you can get in like bulk and stuff, and so I've gotten that a few times, and it's been gifted to me a few times. Which is been awesome, but I ran out of my um, sprouted whole wheat flour.

And I told my husband, I was like, that's probably what I should be making all my sourdough with to make it actually really healthy instead of just my Costco organic unbleached all purpose, which tastes delicious. But I'm like, yeah, I need more back to the whole grains back to the whole. [00:12:00]

Emilie: You're doing the best you can though.

So yeah, we're

Kayla: doing it. We're trying. It's just, and it's far from my house. I'm always like, Oh, I have to go all the way out there. But.

Emilie: Yeah.

Kayla: All right. Back on babies. Sorry. Talking about nutrition and pregnancy and we diverted for just a second. Bacta, you think the Whole30 helped you in terms of like your gut and all that kind of stuff, but it was still really hard because obviously you're so restricted with what you can eat.

I can imagine that was really hard for morning sickness too.

Emilie: It, so I will say the first 15 weeks, every time I've been pregnant, which is only twice, So not as a huge amount of experience, but still in my experience, um, the first 15 weeks, I have a very set time of morning sickness. And at 15 weeks is like, Oh, you're done.

And it's just like magically gone. Coffee starts smelling good to me again. I'm ready to have a cup. Um, but the first 15 weeks I, in my first pregnancy, I literally had Chick fil A chicken cool wraps. Oh nice.

Kayla: For

Emilie: almost every [00:13:00] single meal Day, it was awful. I felt so bad because we were so broke, but it was the only thing that sounded good to me.

And my husband would have to pass the Chick-fil-A on his way home from work every day. And I was like, this is the only thing that I remotely wanna put in my mouth,

Kayla: girl. I get it.

Emilie: So it, I get it so hard. It's so hard. And morning sickness hits me pretty hard. I found, and I. Honestly expected to not have morning sickness with my second because my mom didn't and my health has tracked hers in a lot of ways.

Um, and so that was a big surprise for me with my second. I was convinced I wasn't going to have morning sickness with him. And sure enough, I did 15 weeks.

Kayla: Now you had it like all day, every day,

Emilie: all day. It was, it's always been all day for me. Um, first pregnancy, I just had ginger chews that I would And then I found out you probably shouldn't have too many cause it's harsh and can hurt the baby.

If you have too much ginger. And I was like, what am I going to [00:14:00] do? Um, I drank a lot of good girl moonshine from the trim, healthy mama plan. Have you heard of that before? So my husband cannot stand it. Cause it has apple cider vinegar in it and he, it'll make him gag. Um, but it's, It's like one to two tablespoons of apple cider vinegar in a quart jar and then a half a teaspoon to a teaspoon of ginger.

Then however much stevia you wanna put in it.

Kayla: Mm-Hmm. ,

Emilie: um, or like erythritol or something like that. And then you cover that with ice and then you fill it a quar, it's in a court jar and you fill it all the way to the top with water and just stir it up. It's a really good thirst, quinter. I mean, I drank those nonstop and it was something that actually helped settle my stomach.

Kayla: Wow.

Emilie: But the, the ginger in it helps with the nausea, the apple cider vinegar in the water helps you with electrolytes and just staying hydrated. So I lived off of that and Chick fil A. [00:15:00]

Kayla: Wow.

Emilie: Yeah.

Kayla: Now, if you're anything like me, could you, like, if you think about that meal now, like that Chick fil A meal and that drink, would it make you nauseous to try and eat that now?

No,

Emilie: because after the first 15 weeks I couldn't stand it, so I didn't have it for forever.

Kayla: Right, yeah.

Emilie: Like now that I'm not pregnant, it's, it's fine.

Kayla: It would be fine.

Emilie: Yeah, I get a little bit tired of Chick fil A anyway, so it's not like I go very often to where I'm like, I can't stand it, you know, so.

Kayla: I just know for me, I feel like anything I have when I'm nauseous, it's like when the nauseous phase is over, I don't ever want to eat it again.

Emilie: Yes, I'm that way with smells more, um, so essential oils, if there was an essential oil that I loved while I was pregnant, can't do it after. Um, I think plant therapy has a sleepy, like a kid's sleepy time, essential oil,

Kayla: loved

Emilie: it while I was pregnant. I can't do it because I, a lot of my memories are [00:16:00] attached to smell and I found that, um, so when I, I was pregnant in 2021 with my second born, which was at the height of COVID stuff still, especially at the very beginning of the year.

And so I was super stressed with that. And then on. I was using that sleepy time smell. And so that smell still reminds me of that stressful time. And I just can't do it. So yeah,

Kayla: I get it. Associations are so real with the nausea, like morning sickness. I feel like people think like, Oh, it's, it's no big deal.

Once you're past it, you're past it and it'll never affect you again. I have found that like, so say I was, you know, nauseous in the winter time, I would find that like the following winter I would, like, get these flashbacks of nausea just from, like, interacting with the winter weather or the winter smells or, like, walking into a heated room from a cold outside and, like, oh my gosh, I feel nauseous suddenly because it just reminds me of it.

Or even This is wild. [00:17:00] Songs. Like, I would listen to these worship songs to try and like, get me through my nauseous state, and now if I listen to those worship songs, I'm like, oh, that reminds me of being obnoxious. Like, it is wild.

Emilie: When we told our family that we were pregnant with my firstborn, it was the day of Thanksgiving, and, Before that I had felt fine.

Like we found out two or three days before that. So I really hadn't had a whole lot of opportunity to be sick feeling, but it's on like on Thanksgiving day. That's when I started smelling things and I was like, Oh, this is not good. But I got, um, Broccoli casserole on my plate and I tried it and I, I managed to swallow that one bite, but it was so difficult.

And I didn't have broccoli casserole from 2016 until I want to say 2022 because of that smell.

Kayla: I just

Emilie: couldn't,

Kayla: [00:18:00] couldn't believe it. Okay. Sorry, everyone. We deep dove into nausea and morning sickness and associations, but now you know if you didn't before. So let's talk about the rest of the pregnancy. So once you got past the nausea and stuff, like what was your care like?

Were you seeing an OB? Were you seeing a midwife? Like what was your plan? What, what did it look like?

Emilie: So I saw an OBGYN and midwives at the local hospital. They had a mix. Um, I had my favorites, of course, there was a lot that had well intentioned personalities, but just were not a fit for me. And there was one midwife that I loved, didn't end up having her as my, uh, delivery option because they, I was very surprised to learn as a new mom had never been in the birth world before that you don't get to pick who your doctor is going to be.

And like, they're going to be the ones to deliver your baby. I thought I would have a choice because that's what seems [00:19:00] most logical, like for a better outcome for the mother that she's, she gets to choose who she wants to deliver her baby. But I realized that I didn't have that choice pretty early on. It was really frustrating because a lot of the doctors in the local hospital were incredibly busy.

Like, they were C section doctors through and through. Very like the woman doctor was very caring and very kind, but you could tell she's very busy and down to business. Didn't have a whole lot of time to talk. Um, the male doctor was a former Navy surgeon who turned OBGYN and he was like, they were like, you want him to deliver you if you have to have a C section because he's amazing and fast and like so skilled.

As a surgeon. And I was like, okay, but I don't want to have a surgery. Right. So, um, but I, the latter half of my pregnancy was fine. I just remember being so frustrated that it was so expensive because they made you pay up front. And I was [00:20:00] like, well, if I move or like something changes, or if I have the baby at home on accident.

Like, do I get that money back? I was just frustrated by that. But that played into like my mindset and my emotions, all of that frustration and stuff. At the end of my pregnancy, I had group beta strep, knew nothing about it, even though I read, uh, Ina May's Guide to Childbirth. I somehow came up on that. I don't remember how I discovered that book, but I loved that book.

Kayla: That's a fantastic book that I highly recommend to all first time moms or second or third time moms. And I just read it again for this past pregnancy and it was my fifth, so. Yes.

Emilie: I, I read it every time. And I, I, in each, like, every time I read it, because sometimes I'll just scan through it just to like, curiosity, it's better for me.

Yeah. Um, but each time I read it, I feel like I have to read it less and less because I've, you know. I've heard it before and it's like, Oh wait, yes. It's just a reminder for me at that point, but it's so rich and so good at making you feel confident in your own body. [00:21:00] Um, and my mom had had four vaginal births and like she always spoke highly of birth.

She loved birth. Um, and she, So birth, was very comfortable with it. Her own body taught me to be comfortable with my own body. So birth was not foreign to me. I watched all of my siblings be born via videotape. Um, and so like, it was a very comfortable concept for me, but leading up to my first birth, where I had to get, give birth myself, I found with a group beta strap, they were like, well, we need to put you antibiotics.

So we'll want you to come in and get checked at a certain time. And then I went in for my 30. No, I think it was like 40, 39 or 40 weeks, because I think our timing was off, but it was pretty close to my, my would have been due date. And, um, they were like, okay, well, we know that at your 36 weeks, you had group beta strep and now you're a full term.

Um, [00:22:00] and you're measuring four centimeters dilated and I had been a little crampy, but nothing that I was like, that's definitely labor. So I had my regular checkup for that week and then they were like, well, we're going to want to have you come in tomorrow and we're going to check your measurements, your cervix dilation.

And I came in the next day and I was, why, I don't know. And that's like, that was a frustrating part for me is, um, I think they induced me on purpose because they wanted to make sure that I got the antibiotics. Um, I the time that's what I was like, okay, I'm fine with getting the antibiotics. I was comfortable with that.

Um, I would not do that now knowing what I know now, but at the time, that's what I was comfortable with. And I, it was the midwife that I trusted. Who recommended that I do that.

Kayla: Can we take just a second and explain for those who don't know what, um, group beta strep is or GBS or why you would need antibiotics or what [00:23:00] that is.

So it is a common bacteria. It's just present in our, like you said, our guts. And it can migrate downward into the womb, into your vaginal canal. but it's not dangerous to the mother at all. Um, it's just a type of bacteria. It's no big deal. It has the potential, although it's very small, potential to be dangerous to the baby on the baby's way out of the birth canal.

So Let's say, just for example, baby comes out vaginally, which is what we want, that's what's best for the baby, baby comes into contact with this bacteria, it gives, which, the chance of that is low, but then, even when the baby comes out, the chance of anything happening, even if they did interact with it, come into contact with it, is also extremely low.

And so there are [00:24:00] many moms who have researched this who would opt out of getting antibiotics because we know that antibiotics also carry their own risks, um, for you and the baby. Um, especially with a baby who's just starting out life and if you're wiping their gut from the get go, that can be, um, very hard on the baby as well.

So the other thing about GBS, that's, that's what it's short for, group beta streptococcus is GBS. That's what we're referring to. It can be in and out of the birth canal. It is not there constantly. So if you test positive for it at 36 weeks. It may not be there when you deliver. Also, if you test negative for it at 36 weeks, it could be present at birth.

Like, you don't know, but they, but basically, in the mainstream medical system's mind, they just do a blanket test for everybody at 36 weeks to catch, quote unquote, as many cases as [00:25:00] possible, and then they administer antibiotics. Like, that's their routine policy in order to get rid of this bacteria before it can interact with the baby.

They like to give you two rounds of it before the baby comes out. And everyone says, well, what if I don't get the antibiotics or what if my baby comes too fast or what if I don't get there in time, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. All they do 48 hours after birth. Which, by the way, is what they're going to do if you're delivering in the hospital anyways.

It's not like you're going home any sooner. So it's just, that's what I always like to say, I'm like, the, the protocol is not any different. Like, you know, you're just under observation still, um, because there's a really, really, really, really, really tiny chance that anything was affected at all. So if you do test positive for GBS, if you get the test, first of all, and then if you test positive for it, second of all.

I would look into alternative [00:26:00] routes other than antibiotics because there are some out there if you research it. I didn't want anyone to be listening to this episode and totally in the dark like, what are they talking about? Is that some disease? Like da da da da. So now they know. All right. So your midwife says.

She said, come back tomorrow, even though everything looks great, even though you're four centimeters and everything's healthy and everything's good, she says, come back tomorrow. That's strange. Okay.

Emilie: Yeah. So she said, come back tomorrow. Let's see how far you're measuring. If you're at five to 16 centimeters or anything above four, we're going to want to admit you and the way she said it, she never said the word induce.

She never said anything about getting my labor started. She said nothing about that. And my, my thought process was as a first time mom, not knowing as much as I know now, my thought process was if I'm five to six centimeters, that's halfway to 10, I must be in labor. That's why they want to get me in the hospital.

Because I'm in labor. That was my thought process. And because [00:27:00] she never said induce, I never had any reason to think otherwise. So I go there the next day with my hospital bag, get in for the appointment at 10 o'clock. She says, Oh, you're five to six centimeters. Let's go ahead and admit you. I said, okay, I've got to call my husband.

I hadn't eaten at that point either. You're

Kayla: not in labor. You're just dilated.

Emilie: Just dilated. Yeah. It had felt crampy, but I now having experienced real labor knew that I, you were not in labor. I was not. No, no, it's just uncomfortable.

Kayla: Well I bet, just from like, hearing what you're saying and thinking about this, I'm thinking she wanted to make sure you were in the hospital for labor long enough to get both rounds of antibiotics in before you had the baby.

Um, because if you were that dilated at home, her fear was you wouldn't make it to the hospital in time in order to get both rounds in. But I will say as a mom who also dilates early and was also four centimeters dilated before I went with my first and six [00:28:00] centimeters dilated before I went into labor with my second, it did not shorten my labor at all.

I will just say that. Yeah.

Emilie: Yeah, so I called my husband and he left work and it was like 11 o'clock in the morning. We went to IHOP. Cause I had to eat. I was starving and I knew that they weren't going to let me eat in the hospital. And I was like, I'm going to have one really big last meal because I didn't know how long my labor would last.

Um, that was a mistake because I ended up throwing all of it up when I was in labor, that was not pleasant. Um, but we checked into the hospital and, um, got settled. We watched a lot of dirty jobs shows because that's what was on. There was nothing else to watch so, you know, we watched that. We watched like how it's made and honestly, I was so confused as to why I was there because I did not feel anything.

Like I was just sitting on a birth ball with an IV in my arm. What

Kayla: was in the IV? The antibiotics? It was the antibiotics. So not [00:29:00] Pitocin?

Emilie: No.

Kayla: So they put you on antibiotics and you weren't even in labor?

Emilie: Yeah, and then around five o'clock in the afternoon, they're like, okay, your labor has stalled. Your labor hasn't progressed and not even stalled.

They were like, you just haven't progressed. Um, so we're going to break your water.

Kayla: What? And

Emilie: you're like, what labor? I'm not in labor. Exactly. Well, and I had told, and prior to this, I had done a lot of research and I knew that I didn't want to vaccinate my babies. I knew that I wanted to labor. Um, like I wanted to walk, I wanted to be on my knees, like anything to mitigate.

The possibility of tearing. I told that to the nurse and she was a Bradley nurse. Like she loved the Bradley method. Oh, that's great. And she was very supportive of my birth plan. Um, and so she was like, I'm, I love what you're telling me. I like as a woman, as a nurse, I love exactly what you're telling me, but the doctor on call is, it was that naval [00:30:00] doctor.

And she was like, he, you can labor however you want, but when it's time to deliver, he's going to want you on your back because he's so tall. Because he's so tall. And I remember looking at my husband being like, who is giving birth here, him or me? Like, is the doc, the doctor or me? Like, who's, who's in charge here?

And I was like, okay, whatever. Because I knew my body really well, and I knew what my mom had been through. And I knew that my body was intended to work. And that God made us to have babies. And that I, like, I was super confident. But there had been some decisions that I had made clearly in naivety. And just not knowing.

And so I remember after the doctor broke my water at five o'clock, the nurse and him walk out. They closed that shower curtain thing. That's super annoying. I hate that noise. Um, they did not even leave my room, but they closed that curtain as though it's somehow going to block their noise when I'm talking.

And he said, do whatever you need to do. I [00:31:00] don't want to deliver this baby in the middle of the night. And I looked at Jordan and he was like, Okay, my, my, Jordan is my husband's name, um, and he was like, even my husband, who knows nothing about birth, had done no research with going through the entire pregnancy, like, just knew nothing.

He was even just like, Appalled that the doctor was like that. Like that's your job is to deliver babies. When babies come. Oh my. You know, goodness. Yeah. And so I remember looking at him and being like, I'm not doing what he's saying, because I knew I, I think the Lord really was like giving me enough wisdom, even though I didn't know it.

I think he gave me enough wisdom to know, we're not doing that. We're not gonna do that.

Kayla: I have to know. Did you know you probably, I'm assuming you did not. Because most people don't. Did you know that you could fire that doctor and get a different doctor and a different, like somebody else? Because there is another person in that building who can deliver babies.

No, I didn't because

Emilie: [00:32:00] they said he is the doctor that's available for the next 48 hours to deliver babies.

Kayla: Shoot, no, there is more than one doctor in the hospital who can

Emilie: do that. And I remember thinking like, Nothing's going to come like, and just like, it's just, but also just being, because eventually with my water breaking, they, and I think at some point they gave me pitocin, um, I think my husband told me that they did give me that because I got a little bit out of it and I ended up asking for IV meds because I had heard somebody else's birth story.

And she was like, I didn't want an epidural, but her husband was a physician's assistant and he was like, well you don't have to get an epidural. You can get an IV med to help.

Kayla: Bye.

Emilie: And so at some point I had asked for the IV meds and I was really sleepy. I had been working up until the day before I went into labor.

Kayla: Yeah.

Emilie: Well, forced into labor. Um, and so I was just exhausted. And when they gave me the IV meds, I was just out of it.

Kayla: So,

Emilie: you know, I forget where I'm going with this, but it's, [00:33:00] uh, they, eventually they gave me Pitocin and I had walked so much in the morning that I was tired. And when they gave me that medicine, I didn't keep walking.

Kayla: Yeah. Yeah. Well, you can't, you have to stay in bed once you're on it.

Emilie: Yes. And so it was just gruesh, grueling and excruciating to be in bed and be essentially just be high the entire time

Kayla: because

Emilie: the, whatever dose they gave me, I was really out of it.

Kayla: Yeah. It's IV narcotics through an IV. Like it's strong stuff.

It was,

Emilie: I mean, it felt great at the beginning and, but then as the night wore on, I remember hearing, there was a lady next door to me and she. I think she was attempting a natural labor and she went for 24 hours with an induction and I could hear her moaning and crying and screaming at times. Um, like in the back of my head, I could hear that, but then I remember my [00:34:00] mom being there.

And just being in bed and going like, and groaning and grinding my teeth. I didn't want my mom in there. I just wanted it to be me and my husband, nothing against my mom lover to death, but I just always have wanted it to be very private. And so it's different for me with breastfeeding. Couldn't care who sees my boobs since I'm breastfeeding, but when I'm having a baby, I really want it to be private.

And so I remember him asking her to step out because I was able to vocalize to him. I. Don't let my mom hear anymore. I know that it's getting close.

Kayla: Yeah.

Emilie: And then I think I had another dose of narcotics at some point before 11 o'clock at night. And then I remember waking up to them forcing an oxygen mask on my face.

And that was around one o'clock in the morning, one 15, one 10. I don't know. It was after one o'clock and I remember waking up and they're like, you have to wake up. Here's an oxygen mask. You're, you're going to push now. It was just like, I was like, [00:35:00] what is happening? Like the last thing I remember was just these brief snippets of time.

And before that it was, I was fine. And then I'd like the Pitocin was getting my contractions going. Um, So I'm waking up to my husband trying to wake me up and I knew he knew nothing about birth and knew that like he was not prepared to advocate for me very well.

Kayla: I

Emilie: just remember waking up and being like, what is going on?

And then they're like, okay, push. And I think I got her out within five pushes. I mean, it was very fast for a first time birth. I didn't have, it wasn't an hour long, you know, a lot of, a lot of first time births, they push for like five hours. And I think a lot of that has to do with the hospital system.

But for my body, even being in the hospital within five pushes, I had her out and I had no epidural. I had no numbing. So I did feel her coming out. I remember that really waking me up. Um, and it, it wasn't, and I'll say this, like, it [00:36:00] honestly was not very painful to push her out. Like, it didn't feel to me, and I know I had the narcotics, but I was, once I could feel the pressure of the baby coming, I was awake and I was like, okay, I'm here.

Um, and so I remember feeling her, that ring of fire, the ring of fire did not, did not Um, I also have symphysis pubis disorder. So the muscles in my pelvis get incredibly loose when I'm pregnant, the relaxing in my body from being pregnant really relaxes my pelvic floor. Um, so I think that's part of why maybe the ring of fire wasn't as bad for me.

And pushing my baby out has never been super bad for me. Um, as far as pain, I don't know. But I remember that at one point, the doctor, the baby was coming out and he didn't have to do anything, but I remember he put his finger inside the lip of my vulva and I was like, that hurts. That, that's what was hurting me [00:37:00] was him trying to help a process that was already fine just to get it going.

Like just to get her out faster. I don't know. It, he, it felt like he was punishing me for having a natural birth and not having an epidural because I had met him in the process of having meetings with all of the different care providers before having the baby. And every time I met a new provider, I would hand them my birth plan, which was from mama natural.

I don't know if you know who that is. Um, her birth plan, that's like got the little icons on it. I have had it for both births. My nurses love it. Women doctors and midwives. Um, and then when he found out that I didn't want an epidural, he said, you don't, you know, you don't have to prove anything to anybody.

Right. And that's like, yeah. I just, I love to know what's going on with my body. I don't even take ibuprofen when I'm on my period and have cramps. I'm like, what if something goes wrong? I'll be fine. I mean, I've got to be able to [00:38:00] tell what's hurting, you know,

Kayla: um,

Emilie: so I'm, I don't take medicine unless I need to, and especially painkillers.

And so I was like, I don't, I'm not trying to prove anything. And this is just what I want. And so when I actually had the baby, it was with this doctor, male doctor, and I did tear having her, of course, cause I was on my back. And I had like, he, he was not caring in his care for me.

Kayla: Um,

Emilie: and so as I had the baby on my chest, um, and they're rubbing the baby vigorously and, you know, being very rough with her.

I remember he started to stitch me up and he did not numb me. He didn't do anything for me. He started to stitch me up and I was like, that hurts. And I almost kicked him in the face. because I was like, if you don't give me something to numb the pain, I'm going to be, I'm going to kick you.

Kayla: How bad was your tear?

Emilie: Um, it was a very mild

Kayla: tear. Like a first degree?

Emilie: Yeah. Very minor. And like, um, I remember my husband saying, [00:39:00] That it looked pretty bad, but

Kayla: I know. I never seen a post baby. Yeah.

Emilie: So I remember going to the six week appointment and the nurse was like, you look great. You're fine. It's not that bad. And my recovery was excellent.

It was just. It's super easy. So yeah, I was, I almost kicked him in the face when he didn't numb me. And he like rolled his eyes when I said that, that, that it hurt. And I was looking like, I've got this baby on my chest and I'm like, what is your deal? Like having enough, like mental space in even that moment to just be like, what is this deal?

Like, I don't understand why he's mad at me that I can feel pain. It sounds like he

Kayla: needs to go into a different. Surgical profession.

Emilie: Exactly. Like maybe just be on call for C sections. Maybe be a general surgeon.

Kayla: Yeah,

Emilie: I think he does it for the money, honestly, because it's a constant revolving door of clients.

Kayla: Yep. Yep. Yeah.

Emilie: Um, so, but I just remember being like, [00:40:00] man, you're just a jerk. And so he did numb me after he rolled his eyes. He did numb me finally. And, uh, He stitched me up and they took the baby to put her on the warmer, give her her first bath. My husband did her bath and everything. And then the nurse, uh, really all in that

Kayla: room, just

Emilie: then all in that room, it was so fast.

I mean, like, wow. They, they let her stay on my chest for probably about five, 10 minutes. I don't exactly have a measure of it, but it was a lot. It felt like a lot of time. And, but then as soon as, um, I was distraught. That felt like

Kayla: a lot

Emilie: of time? Because I was a first, first time mom, it felt fine to me. And they wanted me to go to the bathroom and like clean up a little bit.

And so they, while my husband was giving the baby the bath in, this is all in the space of an hour that all this stuff is happening, I think. And, um, again, it was in the middle of the night, even though the doctor didn't want to.

Kayla: That's why he didn't numb you because it was the middle of the night.

Emilie: Exactly.

Um, and so he, uh, the [00:41:00] nurses were excellent. okay. I don't know. I mean, so they, they just, um, I have no words to describe it. They just cared for me and loved on me. I mean, they were just the grace of God to me in that moment. Just excellent nurses. I've never had bad nurses except for like, um, with my second baby and I'll tell you about that later.

But, um, by, by and large, the labor and delivery nurses are just excellent and they care about the jobs. They love their jobs and they love you. Like, like they. We're so supportive of my birth plan. Oh my gosh, I love that it has like red for things you don't want to do and blue for things you do want to do.

So I always tell new, new moms, I'm like, go to Mama Natural, you sign up for her email list and she gives you her birth plan template and you just customize it. Anyway, so we get to the labor and delivery room and that, all that stuff happens and then we, they take us away to Mama Baby, and as soon as I was cleaned up, They put that baby back on my chest and I held her for ever.

I just skin to skin for a long time. And my mom stayed with me that night because we had no one to care for our dogs. So my husband had to go [00:42:00] back to let the dogs get in the bathroom. And then my mom stayed the night with me and. We just held the baby nurse really well. I mean, nursing was so easy with my first born.

It was just, what a blessing. It was such a blessing to me. And especially now having had my second where it wasn't easy, it was such a blessing to me because I was able to know what a good nursing latch is like, what, what it looks like to have a good nursing relationship with your baby. And then when I had my second, It was like, okay, something's not right here.

So, um, yeah, that's the, that's the story of my firstborn. Um, nurses were great after that for postpartum care. And then doctor came by the next, next day and brought me a bib with his, I was delivered by Dr. Stone. So,

Kayla: Oh

Emilie: my gosh. With this picture of a stork. And I, I think I kept it because I was like, said his

Kayla: name on it.

Emilie: It had his name on it and I, I kept it cause I was like, maybe I'm going to want this at some point for like a story to tell my children or something. [00:43:00] This is who not to go to. Yeah. So come to find out in our community, he is not recommended at all by most of the women in the Facebook groups. They're like, he is the guy that you want if you're having a C section, especially emergency C sections.

And apparently his nurses are very open about that with you in private and they will tell you. Um, a lot of them are on the Facebook groups too, and they'll tell you, don't get him if you can help it, but he is who you want, if you want to see section. Um, and so I remember at my six week appointment. I don't know.

It was my one year appointment. That's what it was. It was my one year, um, yeah, your annual checkup. And it was with the same doctor because apparently in that practice, like once you're delivered by that person, they're your gynecologist too. Oh, no. So I was not excited about it, but I was like, I didn't want to fight it.

I was just tired as a first time mom. And I was like, let's just go get this done. Get, get things taken care of and [00:44:00] make sure I'm okay. So I go in and he did. You get up completely naked because he did a breast exam and a pelvic exam. And so I'm on the table with a thin sheet of paper over my breasts and then basically nothing on my bottom.

And he did the breast exam and you just get uncomfortable even as a woman who's never had anything happen to her that would make her uncomfortable with a doctor.

And it's, you know, it's just a thing that you've kept private for yourself and your husband for so long. And so I just remember being like, I'm just ready to get out of there. And while I've got these plastic sheets over me and he's finished with his exams, he's like, you look great. Um, everything's fine.

And then I had gained weight clearly after postpartum cause I was nursing. And I just remember being starving while I was nursing. Like I would eat, I Four eggs, four scrambled eggs, two pieces of toast with butter on them in the morning for breakfast. And I would [00:45:00] still be hungry after eating that just insatiable hunger.

And remember thinking I would not wish this on my worst enemy to be this hungry. And so I gained a lot of weight postpartum, but my nursing relationship was great. So I was like, you know what? She needs the nutrients that I'm getting. I can lose weight later. And it didn't bother me. But at that six week appointment, while I'm still naked underneath this plastic

Kayla: The one year appointment.

Emilie: The one year appointment. I'm still naked. And he's, he says, this is the weight that you should be at. Here's a menu, like a diet plan for you. And it's like a 1500, 1200, no, it was 1200 calorie diet that he handed to me without saying, he didn't say I needed to lose weight. He didn't say anything about me being unhealthy.

He had just looked at my body, had his hands on me. And in me, and said, here's a diet plan for you. And he walked out the door and I remember holding that sheet of paper and the nurse was still in there. Cause I think she had had my daughter, like holding the daughter, my daughter for me [00:46:00] while he was doing the exam.

And I said, men just don't get it. Do they? She said, no, they don't. So she handed me my daughter and I got dressed. I just remember being like it still bothers me to this day just because it's so your body's just so private and I dress modestly so it's not like many people had seen me naked before or had my their hands on me and for a doctor to be that intimate with my body and then say that it was unacceptable without saying it's unacceptable.

And just suggest that I wasn't doing a good enough job to, and I think he asked me about exercise and I was like, it's August and it's really freaking hot. Like, I don't want to go walk outside. And like, it's just hot in general. And it wasn't my priority at the time. I can lose weight at any time in my life, but nursing was my number one priority at that time.

Kayla: Well, when you're nursing a 1200 calorie a day, a 1200 calories a day is, is not good for a normal person, but when you're nursing. I mean, gosh, that's like [00:47:00] less than half probably what you need.

Emilie: And the food on the diet was like cottage cheese and I hate cottage cheese. Like it was just all these foods that are so bland and so like disgusting to me already.

And I was like, I'm not even going to do this. And I threw it in the trash as soon as I got home. And, you know, I stopped nursing my daughter at a year because. She just wasn't doing nursing for nutrients at that point. It was just a comfort thing and she kept popping off. And at the time I was just so frustrated by it.

I was like, you're done. She was hardly nursing anyway. Yeah. I was like, you know what? You're not nursing very much. Like, let's just stop. But like to be told at your annual appointment, you're fat, essentially. It was just so. Like it, it really messed with me. So I never went back to him again. And I told my husband, it's like, next time I want a home birth for sure.

Like, that's what I want. And he was like, okay, I'm not super comfortable with that, but I know that that this doctor was pretty awful. So we'll find something. All right. And I think maybe I settled on a birth center that no longer [00:48:00] exists anymore. Um, but at the time that was available to me, I was like, you know, if we have another baby, It'll be a birth center birth because I'm not dealing with a stupid doctor anymore.

I'm just not going to do it. It was, he was just so awful. And so many of the people that we've met in person who had babies were like, Oh, you had your birth at this hospital. Who was your delivering doctor? And if they say that it's that guy, we're just always like, so what do you think about his bedside manner?

They're like, Oh, he's awful. He's pretty awful. Like every review I've heard of him is like awful. So I mean, what was strange because he was a father And he had children and like his children's artwork was in his exam room. Yeah. At the doctor's office. So I was like, Oh, you know, he's going to be really nice.

And he was in the Marine Corps. He was a, he was in the Navy. He was stationed where my husband had been stationed. And so I thought, you know, this is going to be great. And it ended up being so awful.

Kayla: Did any of that play into your postpartum at all? Or were you able to kind of like tuck that away or like not associate it?

Emilie: I remember I did [00:49:00] not like, like my six week appointment doesn't stand out to me. Um, I'm a really frustrated. The first week of postpartum where they were like, you can't lift her, do anything, but here's a car seat and a baby, and you have to be back in a week. And it makes no sense. I like, they're like, you can't drive, but you need to be back here in a week.

And I'm like, thankfully my mother in law was available. Cause my husband had to go back to work within that first week. And, um, I was like, they don't want me driving, but I don't know how else to get there. And so she was like, I'll take you. She was great. She was like, She would come over and do laundry for me.

She would make meals for me or like snacks. It was a lot of snacks because I was so hungry all the time. Um, and then she would watch the baby for me when I did some homeschool stuff for a local homeschool group. And she was so supportive of my breastfeeding journey, like just. It's super supportive, mother in

Kayla: law

Emilie: all around.

Kayla: What a great mother in law.

Emilie: Yeah. My mother in law was great.

Kayla: So [00:50:00] how long, well, I mean, you told us their ages, so I guess it was like three ish years later when baby number two came along. Tell me about that. I don't know how it went down. You do. You tell me.

Emilie: It was pretty similar to the first. We just were like, you know what, we're ready.

Let's just stop preventing it. Um, got pregnant that first month. And I just, I remember when my husband and I were dating and we were engaged and I was telling him, we were talking about birth control options and things like that. I was like, I really don't want to go on birth control because I know what it can do to your body, but I also wanted freedom.

To just be intimate with my husband whenever, but then I also told him, I was like, I'm pretty sure that I'm a fertile myrtle and that we, we probably needed to be a little bit more drastic. So I had been on the pill for that first year and a half of marriage, but I came off of it. So,

Kayla: so what'd you do on the in between between the two kids?

Uh, what they don't suggest

Emilie: the

Kayla: pullout

Emilie: method, we just, we, cause we really were like, you know, if it [00:51:00] happens, it happens like it, it was just a, We just viewed babies as a blessing and, um, we knew that, you know, money figures itself out. And if God gives you

Kayla: a baby, God will provide for that baby.

Emilie: Exactly. And so we were trying to be wise.

You know, we did want to wait a little bit financially and our income has grown every year that we've been married. So it's all worked out for us, but, um, You know, we, uh, we got pregnant the first month with our second. And then, um, we got, I think we got pregnant in December of 2020 and I found out January 30th of 2021.

And I remember how I knew I was pregnant because I was supposed to be starting my period soon. And, but it wasn't, it was like too early to test if, cause I hadn't missed my period yet. And then we went to breakfast at Cracker Barrel that morning on a Saturday. Okay. I tasted the coffee and I was like, this doesn't taste good to me.

Kayla: There it is. And I was like,

Emilie: [00:52:00] Oh, I think I'm pregnant. And so we had a whole day just shopping and it was just a fun day. And then that night I took a test secretly because I was like, I just know. And with my first, I knew I was pregnant. Because I couldn't lay on my stomach to sleep and I felt like there was something in my stomach.

I was a lot skinnier with my first, before I had her. Exactly. And, um, so I, I'm a stomach sleeper. And so I couldn't sleep on my stomach. And I was like, that's a sign to me that something's not right. Cause it felt like there is a bean in my tummy. It was so weird. But for my second, I had a little bit more weight on me.

And so I was really not sure if I was pregnant until I took the test. But I was pregnant and told my husband and he was like, I knew I knew you were gonna be pregnant like because we had been trying You know and not for a month thing. Yeah for like a month. And so, uh, you know, he was like, I just knew it I knew you're gonna be pregnant.

Just he just I guess he felt it in his gut too. Yeah So [00:53:00] we were super excited. The care plan was totally different. I think I told you, you know, we had wanted to have a birth center birth for the second, but COVID happened in 2021 or 2020 and 2021 and he, my husband. When we were talking about wanting to get pregnant, I was like, listen, I don't want to have a birth center birth.

I was like, I want to have a home birth. And he was like, you know what? After all we've seen in 2020, I'm fine with that. And you know, my, one of my best friends is a doula. I was like, she has connections. Is your best friend. Christian Jordan.

Kayla: Yay! From

Emilie: Holistic Heritage.

Kayla: I had a feeling that's who you were going to say when you said we're in Alamance.

I was like, I bet it's Christian.

Emilie: Yes. Oh my gosh. I don't know what I would do without her friendship. She's an amazing friend. Um, she's great at what she does and she really cares about her clients and um, I think she doesn't pay herself enough from her.

Kayla: She doesn't. She doesn't. She doesn't.

Emilie: But she's like her, it's her ministry too.

So,

Kayla: um,

Emilie: Shout out to her.

Kayla: We love [00:54:00] Christian. She's recording, um, LMA's birth story soon, I think next Friday, this Friday. Oh, fun.

Emilie: Yeah. So I had a lot more support. We had had that first experience with my firstborn and then COVID had happened and we just saw the overreach. And I was like. All right. Bye. Um, you know, if at the time they were the hospital system.

I was at a very strict about like, we will separate you from your baby. If you have COVID.

Kayla: If you

Emilie: test positive and if your spouse test positive for COVID they can't be with

Kayla: you.

Emilie: And so I was like, listen, I'm not going to be separated from my baby. Cause the best thing for my baby is breast milk. And. I'm not just not going to let that happen.

And so with the resources that I had available to me and more support for my husband this time, because he had had that first experience and we had lived through the pandemic and just seen so much going on. Um, you know, we decided to have a home birth. I got connected with a CPM midwife certified professional midwife.[00:55:00]

Um, and did things on the sly cause North Carolina is not friendly to CPMs. Um, but I, we're familiar. Yes. So, um, I have no regrets whatsoever. It was just night and day with my care. She came to my house, even with her having a student there, it was, it was And then she was like, okay, find the baby's heartbeat.

And the student couldn't find the heartbeat. So I said, oh, yeah, I'm just, it's just that I thought they had a heartbeat. They had to be in the baby's heartbeat. And she said, yeah, and I just said, yeah, that's fine. But I really didn't know that I was in the baby's heartbeat. like, not on me. I was just like, it was hard to let go of it.

And then that's when it, yeah, something just, I guess it just, it hit me. It was like, the baby's heartbeat, and I didn't know what to do. You And I was like, this is a mistake. That is a mistake

Kayla: for your first appointment. That's

Emilie: absolutely, it was not the

Kayla: way to do it. So

Emilie: scary. Um, so the midwife did find the heartbeat obviously, but so for this appointment, the student midwife [00:56:00] was truly just a student and an observational student and did not interfere with the process of me and my midwife discussing everything.

Um, And so just my husband met the midwife too. So it was just so good. My daughter was there, got to involve her with listening to the baby's heartbeat. And it was just so good. It was so, um, healing from the first birth because after my first birth, I didn't think anything had gone wrong until like, I looked back on it.

As time went by and things kept popping up and just learning more and more, I was like, this wasn't right. And so this was really healing for me to have a woman caring for me, who wanted to honor all of my decisions, who was willing to transfer. If anything happened, came up with a plan so that she didn't get in trouble.

And I didn't get in trouble, um, would not have cared if I had COVID or not, because she knew the best thing for my baby was me, um, [00:57:00] just gave so much care. So in May we went to. Get an ultrasound, which you don't have to go to a hospital to get an ultrasound. They have standalone services for that. You just have to look for them and found out it was a boy, which was surprising for us because I come from a family of three girls and a boy, and my husband comes from a family of three girls and a boy.

And he's the boy. Um, and I'm the oldest girl on my side. So we just thought that we were either going to continue or break the cycle of three girls and a boy. And we ended up breaking it and we have a little boy now. Um, and it was just such a shock because we just so expected it to be a girl

Kayla: because it

Emilie: really, the pregnancy really mimicked my first pregnancy, except for the morning sickness.

The morning sickness was all day still, but I was better prepared for it and ate healthier and slept better. was just, it was just all around better because I just felt more prepared. Um, and so the, the, the ultrasound tech was like, well, I usually have to fight to figure out if it's a boy [00:58:00] or a girl, but I don't have to fight today.

It's a boy. And my husband's face was just like, Um, and so it was really special. We had a whole day, just, he had taken the day off of work and we'd had a whole day in Kanapolis, uh, going to Bass Pro Shops and just spending time together as a family. So that was just another healing aspect for me. Cause it was just so pleasant, I guess, just no issues along the way, no one having opinions or things like that.

So fast forward, my husband was in the Marine Corps and he had been a firearms instructor, and he's just really talented in that industry. He, I mean, he, at the time that this podcast is coming out, everybody will know about. Uh, and I will be able to, to, to, to talk about the assassination attempt on Trump recently.

And my husband was able to just listen to that audio and know what kind of rifle or a handgun or whatever guns the guys had used. And he was able to pinpoint what it had been. So he's just really knowledgeable about that. And we had found a [00:59:00] job in Georgia and I was like, you know what you, you just need to apply just to this gun company, manufacturer, just in case.

It works out. And so on a whim, we reached out to that company, submitted his resume, and he got a job offer to go to Georgia in the middle of this pregnancy. And so, um, it was a really big step of faith because it was his dream job. It was more money than he was making where we were in North Carolina. And we, like, I just remember being like, this, this is just the Lord's blessing.

It's that he gets to work at a job that he's always wanted. And, um, I know that not everybody might not be comfortable with firearms, but for my husband, that's his like passion is firearms. And so it was like, we had to go, I was convinced. I was like, you've got to go to this job. You're never going to have an opportunity like this because they didn't have a job for him until he reached out and sent him his resume and they made a job.

Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, it was just like, it was so clear to me that we needed to follow [01:00:00] that path and go, cause it was like, see how the Lord loves you. Like he knows that this is what you love and he's given you this job. And so we started making plans to move. And so I told my midwife at the time, I was like, you know what, I am going to be moving.

I won't be delivering in North Carolina anymore. I'm going to try to find midwifery care in Georgia. That was late July.

Kayla: I'm like, wait a second. You live in North Carolina still. So I'm like waiting to see what happens here. It's a

Emilie: whole story. It's a, it's a big story. I'm going to do my best to not cry when it gets to like the intense part, but, um, that was late July.

So all of August, we spent all of August packing up our house. September 6th was my sister in law's wedding, and then September 8th, we all got COVID. Except for my husband because he was already in Georgia at his new job at that time. And I was just at the house, like letting it be open for tours and people to buy it and things like that.

And so, um, me, my daughter, my father in law, my mother in law, my [01:01:00] sister in law who got married. And I think even her husband, we all got COVID that week. Like it was like

Kayla: bad or like, like you just tested positive for it.

Emilie: So it was gradual for me. Um, and again, I'm eight months pregnant. So it's a little bit different.

You know, the risks are a little bit higher. My daughter had it and I thought she just had a cold and then I was fine. Felt a little fatigued because I used to take her on walks in our neighborhood every day and I remember taking her for a walk and being like, this is a little bit harder. Like something's all right.

And, um, like the next day I wasn't able to smell or taste anything. And I was like, maybe I've got a cold, but that at the time, that was one of the signs that you had COVID is you couldn't taste or smell anything. And so I took, I took a blade plugin that I had in the house because we were having realtors come in and out.

I wanted the house to smell nice and I stuck it like right under my nose. And I couldn't smell the apple cinnamon scent at all. Like there was no hint of a scent to me. I was like, [01:02:00] okay, I've got COVID texted family, found out my father in law, my mother in law and my sister in law had it. And, um, as soon as I figured out that I had it, like the next day, I was just so fatigued and my daughter was really fatigued too, but she was.

And, um, she was just in bed with me watching TV and I remember I slept a lot. I don't remember everything while I had COVID because I slept so much and I would wake up, make sure, and like my daughter would tell me if she needed something and I would get up and get it for her. But I remember the fatigue was intense.

I went to go get monoclonal antibodies because that was a new thing at the time. And I had talked to a nurse friend of mine. And she I think she had been pregnant at the time and she got it. And she was like, I would get it if I was pregnant, just because it can help you recover faster. And I couldn't find any research that said otherwise.

Like I did a lot of research as much as I could before I went to go get it. And, um, Got it done and ended up [01:03:00] throwing up really bad that night, which is apparently an adverse effect of those antibodies. So I don't know if, if that's like bad, I don't know if that shows that they're bad or not, but I just remember feeling like I shouldn't have done that.

Cause I felt worse afterwards. Um, so my husband came up from Georgia and took my daughter down to be With my mom and she ended up being there for two weeks without me so that I could help wrap up the house. I still had COVID, but I went to the hospital. And that's when my husband took my daughter down and then he came back up to be with me.

And um. Wait, was your mom in Georgia then? She was. My family is from Georgia, so they were all in Georgia. And the job.

Kayla: So is that why he applied to Georgia?

Emilie: Well, so he applied because the job was the job that he wanted, but it like, well, the company was the job that he wanted, but, um, it was, we found out that it was like 30 minutes from my hometown.

So we can [01:04:00] just live in my hometown with my family. It'd be great. We'll have help. We won't be alone. So that's another reason we just felt like it was such a blessing. So my mom had my daughter in Georgia, husband came back up to be with me because I was almost nine months pregnant and still had COVID.

But, you know, after I think. I think after 10 days, you're not contagious anymore. I think that's what they said at the time. I know there's different variants now, so it's different. But at the time I was like, well, you know, it's not that bad anymore. And so he came up to help me. We closed out the house.

Father in law ended up being in the hospital. He had a lot of comorbidities with. COVID. He had diabetes and all kinds of issues and, um, ended up being in the hospital and it was not a good situation. The closing date for our house got pushed back twice because of COVID and family things. So we ended up closing out our house, sold it, gave out the keys, and we stayed with my mother in law for, Like a day [01:05:00] and my father in law was in the hospital at a time.

We were just praying for him. And we were like a week away from my due date. And so, and you

Kayla: established care in Georgia at that

Emilie: point. So in the month of August, I managed to find a midwife. I called my grandma because we, At the time we were running out of time because of COVID, we hadn't had time to find a house and go buy a house in Georgia.

And so we were going to stay with my grandma until we found a house. And so I had found a midwife, a home birth midwife, uh, through friends of mine too, who I had gone to church with in college, and she came so highly recommended and she was willing to take me on last minute, like, and she prayed about taking me on too.

Just Holy Spirit filled. And it was her and her mom, her mom was her doula. So they were a midwife doula team and she was a CPM. And then Georgia CPMs are not as highly regulated as they are in North Carolina. So it was a lot [01:06:00] easier. Didn't have, you don't have to be secret. So if you're in Georgia, Renee Rojas in North northeast Georgia is who I used.

So I called my grandma and I was like, you know, can I. Give birth and you're a master bath and she's like, yeah, that's fine. Um, I guess so. She wasn't gung ho about it. Um, you know, she wanted me to be happy, but she was like, uncomfortable with it because in my family's mind, home birth equals death, honestly.

Like that's just what they think. Yeah. And so I had asked my mom and she was like, no, cause if anything happens, I don't want to associate my bathroom with anything bad happening to you. And I was like, okay. So I ended up, my grandma called me back after talking to my grandpa and they were like, we're just not comfortable with you giving birth in our house.

And, um, so I ended up not being able to have a home birth. Like I met my midwife one day, the next day she came back to see me cause it was, okay. I have to back up. [01:07:00] It's so complicated and I'm just like thinking about it. Okay. So. October 4th, my husband and I had sold our house. My, my father in law was still in the hospital, was not doing well, but, um, from the information that we had, and every other time he had been hospitalized, he had always recovered.

And so we, My husband had to get back to his job. And so we drove down October 4th to Georgia and moved to Georgia officially as a family. We're in Georgia. Um, things were not good, but we had like, our pastors were calling us and praying for us and we had so much going on. I don't think we realized the gravity of the situation with my father in law.

October 5th, I'm in Georgia for one day and my husband, my father in law passed away the next day, like at two o'clock in the afternoon, I think. And so my husband called me. And he's like, Hey, my dad just passed. And I said, you need to go be with your mom. [01:08:00] And you need to go tell your dad goodbye. Knowing that I'm 40 weeks, I was, I was, it was my 40th week.

And I was like, I'm not going to stop you from going to say goodbye to your dad. So, um, I'm living at my grandparents house who they live part time in Utah, part time in Georgia. They have a cabin in Utah. And so they had for the summer, they stay in Utah because it's a lot cooler and less humid in Utah.

And then. In October, they always come back. And so my dad lives with my grandparents. And so it was me, my dad, and my daughter at my grandparent's house, just having a big old party, essentially, um, just hanging out. And so we drove down to Georgia, October 4th, October 5th. My husband goes to work, my, his dad passes away.

And that night he drives back to North Carolina within 24 hours of driving from North Carolina. So it was a really stressful time. And so he drives back and at my whole prayer that whole week. Was help me rest Lord [01:09:00] and help my husband make it back for the baby's birth. And I was able to rest and it was so good to be back with my daughter again, because I'd been apart from her for two weeks.

Um, but the Lord worked that out because my sister had graduated from college that May and didn't start her job until the two, after the two weeks, like the day that I picked her up. From my sister, my sister started her job that day. So for two weeks, she was, and I think she'd had like a summer job, but she had a two week break.

And so my daughter was able to stay with my sister for two weeks and be cared for by people that I trust. I didn't have to scramble for everything. And to the hospital system where I'm from in Northeast Georgia, if you're from Georgia, listening to this, the Northeast Georgia medical center hospital system is very patient friendly.

Um, and. Very pro, um, with birth, at least very pro, um, letting [01:10:00] you labor on your own. They're very heavily midwife led. There's still OBGYNs. It's a very vast system because Northeast George is very large. Um, but they, like, I remember looking it up and making OBGYN that week to be seen and just telling them what I wanted.

And they had a whole form that you could fill out a birth plan for them with. So it's a very birth friendly hospital system, which was such a change from whatever I experienced in North Carolina. North Carolina was like, you're going to do it this way because we're run by Duke or UNC. Like it's just, it's just so different in North Carolina.

And I do think the politics plays into that a lot. Georgia is very much more conservative and very, um, uh, personal rights. Like you, the government can't touch you. The hospital system can't touch you because you're your own person. Um, and so I think that plays into the differences that I've experienced in North Carolina versus Georgia.

So, and I don't want to bring politics up into this, but that does play into [01:11:00] my stories at least. And, um, so that week I'm finding out that I'm not having a home birth in Georgia was hard for me. Um, it puts a strain on my relationship with my family. We've worked it out. We're all good now. Um, but I remember my husband calling me and being like, listen, I know this is not what you want, but let's have a hospital birth for you just so that you're taken care of because I might not be there for the birth.

And, and two, we needed people to watch my daughter and for the birth and everything. And so my whole plan prior to moving to Georgia, it was going to be a very peaceful birth in my dining room. Like I had it all set up. It's like just my design in my head and what was going on. And so it was a grieving process for me to realize I'm not getting the home birth that I want.

Kayla: Yeah.

Emilie: I'm not getting anything that I had prayed for and asked for with my, after my first birth, but knowing that the Lord was going to take care of me. So that whole week I'm resting, praying every day, every hour, [01:12:00] Lord, please let Jordan make it back for the birth of his son. Because I wanted his birth experience to be redeemed as well because as a first time dad, he didn't know any different with the first one.

Just like I didn't know any different, but we both knew it wasn't right or it wasn't the best. Saturday was the funeral for my father in law. And Friday evening, my mom was like, come spend the night with me at my house. My parents are divorced. So my mom had her house, which was like 20 minutes away. And so my mom was like, bring Evelyn, let's have a sleepover at my house.

And that whole day I had been really tired and I had been crampy. And then that evening I started to get consistent. Light pains in my back and in my stomach. And it felt a lot like mild period cramps, but they exhausted me like truly. And, and too, I'm post COVID that I had had for almost 15 days. I was having, having COVID and moving and all of that stuff.

Father in law passing, just a lot of [01:13:00] stress, a lot of like medical stress, and then I'm pregnant. And so it was a lot. So I was exhausted easily by what I now know where contractions. And I remember looking at my mom and again, she's very birth friendly, like had beautiful births for herself, vaginal births.

She had epidurals and I knew I didn't want an epidural again, but she was very attuned to what birth was supposed to be like, and so she was like, I think you're having. Contractions and that you're in labor and like pre pre labor and stuff. And so go to her house and have dinner with my family that night.

And I'm just sitting there and being like, it's making me catch my breath. These, these curbs and contractions that I'm having. And my mom, my mom sitting across the table from me, she's like, you're in labor. I was like, yeah, I know, just like finally experiencing what it was like because it was my first, I was induced without being told that I was being induced.

Um, and so it was redeeming in that way because I was able to experience what it's like to go into labor. And so, um, again, that night I printed out my birth plan from mama natural, set it up again. And this [01:14:00] time I'm having a boy. So I was able to put on there, you know, we don't want circumcision. We don't want these things.

It was, It's pretty similar to my first one, except for the circumcision part. And so my sister drives me at one o'clock in the morning, drives me to the hospital and, um, she helps me labor. I did you, I was extremely tired. So I tried to rest as best I could cause it's the middle of the night. I used a lot of nitrous oxide because it was just helping me at that moment.

In the first stages of labor, water hadn't, water hadn't broken yet. Um, um, When I got there, I was really frustrated with the nurse that walked me to my room because there was a lady in labor in the room next to mine. And the nurse was like, Oh, she was a home birth transfer. And I don't know why she was transferred.

Obviously they didn't tell me that, but I was like, Oh, okay, cool. Like I was supposed to have a home birth and the nurse looks at me. She's like, well, I'm glad that you're safe now.

Kayla: What?

Emilie: Yeah. It was just like the most [01:15:00] condescending. I'm glad that you're making a better choice. Like just so condescending in her, in her tone to me.

And I remember looking at her like, do I just like give it to her and just let her like, do I educate her? And I was like, no, I'm too tired. Just educate her

Kayla: in this moment right now.

Emilie: I was like, it's 1 30 in the morning and I'm looking at my sister and I'm like, and she's like, don't do it. Let's talk

Kayla: statistics right

Emilie: now.

Yeah. And I was like, okay. Okay. Um, so. You know, that until my sister had a wedding that the next day, and again, the COVID regulations are still standing. So I was only allowed to have two people with me, which was a lot because in North Carolina, you were only allowed to have one partner. Yeah. You're one.

So I was allowed to have two people. So my sister left and providentially. My best friend from college was coming in town to visit family that day. And I was like, I still don't want my mom in there, but I was comfortable with my best friend being there because I knew she wasn't going to be looking at me as much.

I don't know. I just, I guess I'm just funny about that. I don't know. It's, it's hard for me to [01:16:00]even understand or explain, but I just knew that I didn't want my mom there, but I wanted my best friend there. And she was like, do you need me at that birth? Like, I'll be there. And I was like, if you could come, that would be such a blessing.

To me. So at 5 a. m. She shows up to the hospital. She's my second person. And that was only supposed to be my, my sister and Hannah is her name. And, um, so Hannah stayed with me all day. She helped me walk. I walked and walked and walked and walked that hospital floor. Just like a thousand circles of that hospital.

I felt like, cause I was like, I know what I'm doing now. This is going to be so different. Um, I didn't get any IV pain meds. I was like, we're going to work through this. And I didn't have the money to pay for the pain free birth course from pain free birth, but I watched her videos religiously that summer.

And I was like, I'm going to learn her tips and tricks that she has for free. And so what really helped me, it was walking. And again, I, this is natural labor, nothing's being forced. I [01:17:00] didn't have Pitocin. Labor started on its own for me. And so I did get to the hospital too early, I think, because it was still pretty early labor, but my family wasn't able to care for me because of everything going on, they were not prepared to have a woman go into their house.

Yeah. So I went to the hospital cause that's where I needed to go. And so. I'm walking. And anytime I had a contraction doing the cow lips or blowing a raspberry, it like, it just helps so much. I like, I tell that to everyone I meet who's pregnant. I'm like, listen, you're going to feel like a blooming idiot, but you need to like blow raspberries.

And what helped for me too, was opening my mouth, not just blowing a raspberry, but like, well, just having my mouth, keeping it loose. Yeah. And so it was night and day. Like, it was just so manageable for me, even as, with somebody who has SPD, symphysis pubis disorder, like, I, it's, and symphysis pubis disorder is incredibly painful for me.

Yes. [01:18:00] It's incredibly painful for many women, but with labor, it's almost like it's a benefit to me because it's much looser downstairs. It doesn't feel like I'm, I think I'm not able to fight as much against the pain that I'm experiencing. So I thought that was a blessing, but the, just walking around, I walked for, you know, You probably walked miles.

Multiple times an hour. Yeah. And so, that whole day was the funeral for my father in law. And I remember being like, if I can just get to Sunday, my daughter will be here. And I got to eight centimeters and my son was stuck in my left hip. Like he was on my left side, he was head down and he was facing the right way.

So there was no issue there. And I had told him, you know, I want to birth on my hands and knees to avoid tearing. Cause I tore last time and I don't want that this time. I don't want to tear. And the midwife that was assigned [01:19:00] to me had had five all natural. Well, she had four all natural vaginal births and one, one of her babies, her fifth baby had been in the emergency C section, but that was the only emergency C section she had had.

Every other birth that she had had had been vaginal and completely natural, no epidural. So she was super supportive of what I was doing, even in that hospital setting. Like she was so hands off. I barely saw my midwife, but. I had a nurse named Ellen and, I'm not going to cry, Ellen knew the Lord. She was a believer.

And I don't know what it was, the Holy Spirit probably told her, and she spent most of the day with me and Hannah in that room. And we just talked about Jesus and we talked about birth. We talked about the chosen TV show. And I like in that part of the show that I told her about was when Mary is talking to the disciples and Jesus is.

ministering and healing [01:20:00] people and he had been doing that all day and so exhausted when he gets back. And, um, she washes his feet when he gets back and it's just a tender and I'm not gonna cry. I'm gonna cry. Um, and just being able to talk freely about the Lord in a heavy political climate. And a heavily political medical system, even for a happy medical system, like in Northeast Georgia, there's still that unknown of like, what do these people believe about my right to give birth, how I want to give birth.

And even with it being super friendly, I had had bad experiences in North Carolina. And I was just like, Oh, this could be so bad so quick, but it was such a blessing to have Ellen there to be able to talk about the Lord, to be able to just. Be comfortable and to know the Lord was taking care of me in those moments and like, just tangibly feeling the Lord care for me and like my birth plan for North [01:21:00] Carolina when we live there was not bad and my birth plan for Georgia was not bad, but they didn't work out and it was like, God blessed me in spite of that.

Not working out. And he was like, I don't, I don't believe that my hospital birth was what was intended. I think the Lord blessed it in spite of what happened. Um, because I definitely still would have preferred a home birth, but it was like, he was like, nothing in your life right now is working out how you wanted it to.

But we're going to make this as best as we possibly can in these moments. And so I ended up, when he was stuck at eight centimeters, I was like, I'm exhausted. I'm just so tired. And I broke down and I told my midwife, I said, I want an epidural. Because I'm just so done to, I am just tired. And I was like, I don't want to C section because I can't do this.

I'd rather have an epidural. And I knew in my body and in my mind that if I [01:22:00] had an epidural, that my baby would relax and he would come. And this is, she was such a good midwife, Kayla. She just was so amazing because she was like, I'm not going to give you an epidural if you're going to beat yourself up about it later, I'm not going to let you be mad at yourself for not having a natural birth.

And I was like. I really appreciate that, but I'm really freaking tired. I've made peace with that. And I had made peace with it like two hours before. And I was like, I'm going to keep trying until about five o'clock. And at five o'clock, I was like, I'm, I really would like to, or I may have the time off, but at some point in the afternoon, I was like, I'm, I'm done now.

And so she was like, I'm not going to do it unless you're okay with it. And you're not going to beat yourself up later. Oh, I promise. And so, um, yeah. She's like, okay, she's like, I can break your water right now at eight centimeters, and that baby will be here in an hour. And I was like, I know that, and I know that's probably what's better for my body, but I still would really like an epidural because I'm just so tired and I don't want to have to work anymore.[01:23:00]

And I knew that my body would relax anyway by itself as soon as I had the epidural, because it was just so under so much stress and pressure. And I knew that my son was going to be there before my husband got there. And so, um, I think they, they gave me my epidural. I thought it was a syringe. Honestly, I had no idea that it's more like a chain that they send up your back.

So that was interesting for me to learn. Like a catheter in your back. Yeah. Yeah. And so I was like, okay, that's a little bit different than what I expected. Um, I still have nerve pain from my epidural and I had a lot of back weakness after my epidural. I don't regret getting it because I know I definitely think that's what I needed to do at the time, but I will say like if you're thinking about getting it, just be prepared for a lot of weakness in that area.

My mom, she, the first time she gave birth was, 33 years ago, and she still, she had epidurals for all four of her babies. She still gets back twinges at the epidural site for where she had hers. So just be [01:24:00] aware if you're going to give birth that that can happen. But, um, anyway, so I got my epidural and they gave me fentanyl before the epidural to help me relax.

I think because I, they didn't want me to be too profigitive while they were giving me the epidural.

Kayla: Yeah.

Emilie: And, um, it immediately helped me relax. I don't like that I had to get it, but I don't regret it either. Um, just cause I was truly so tired, Kayla, like just, like my body had gone to the point of exhaustion and emotionally, physically, and spiritually, it was just so all encompassing.

And so, um, I got the epidural and it's just me and Hannah hanging out, um, waiting for my husband to call for when the funeral was over. And does he know that

Kayla: you're in labor?

Emilie: Yeah. Oh yeah. He knew he knew. And I told him to stay because he needed to give the eulogy at his dad's funeral. And I wanted that for him.

Like I, It, it was sad for me that he wasn't going to be there, but I also knew that he was in the right [01:25:00] place because he had not seen his dad or really talked to his dad prior to his dad passing, because it was just that time of moving. It was just so chaotic. Um, and so I wanted him to be there to finish out that thing for his dad.

So he was getting text updates and I think it was four 30 in the afternoon. So my time earlier was off because I didn't remember it being four 30 in the afternoon. We call him and on FaceTime and we're like, listen, she's about to have the baby. I was fully effaced, fully dilated. And, um, I remember talking to my midwife, her last name is Dees, D E E S.

Um, so if anybody in Georgia needs her, but she's great. Um, But she, I was like, well, listen, I had planned on birthing on my hands and my knees to avoid tearing. I said, what? I know I can't do that with an epidural. She's like, no, you've got to be on your back. And I was like, yeah, some people let me, she was like, I'm just not comfortable with you doing that because I was so tired, I think.

[01:26:00] Um, she's like, no, I would prefer you on your back. But she's like, but we're not tearing today. You're not going to tear. I'm not going to let you. I was like, okay, whatever. Like, I don't know how you have control over that, but they used. Olive oil or coconut oil. I want to say to massage my perineum for a little bit.

Um, I don't remember if my water broke naturally or if they broke it themselves. Um, I remember it breaking. I just don't remember how it happened, but I was, my baby was coming. It was just, he was coming. So when I, what I knew about myself was that he would, my body would relax if I had that epidural and that's what happened.

And it was like, he just shifted. I'm going to go through my story about how I got into the birth canal. As soon as I was relaxed enough. Um, And so I was on FaceTime. My husband was on FaceTime. My friend was holding my phone to FaceTime my husband. And, um, I gave birth to Gabriel and he was nine pounds, four ounces, [01:27:00] and.

Ready for the world. Just such a big baby. Um, I don't look super pregnant when I'm pregnant. Um, and it's not, I don't like it about myself because my belly tends to just be straight up and down. So it's like extended a little bit, but the way my babies lay, they lay very straight up and down. Gabriel was more to the side, but still very vertical.

And so, um, it was just like, I just don't look super pregnant. And then it's just like, bam, right there. Um, He was so much bigger than we expected because I don't look super pregnant. That's what it was. Ellen was such an advocate for me and my nurse and Ellen, I remember saying my mom is outside in the waiting room.

I know I'm only allowed to have two people. My two people are here. What one one had left and I wasn't supposed to have another one to replace her. It was just supposed to be those two people. Right, right. And it's like my sister is gone. She's not coming back and I said my mom is outside. You And I'd like her to be here now, [01:28:00] um, cause Hannah has to go.

She had been there since 5 AM and she was tired. And, um, Ellen looked at the midwife and she was like, her situation is very different. I think we can let her mom come back and the midwife and the Lord just blessed me then and then it was like, yeah, bring her back. It's fine. And so rules were broken for me because of my situation.

And it's like, the Lord was just taking care of me again. Um, so my mom comes back. We're all kind of a mess because it had just been such a wild ride to get to that point. Um still on FaceTime with my husband and He was like, can I bring my mom to see the baby? And, um, I'm just a mess crying. I think I sent you a picture of me crying, holding my husband on FaceTime to see the baby.

Um, but I talked to my mother in law and she was like, Oh my gosh, I'm so proud of you. And it was just all of my [01:29:00] nurses who were in the room at the time I gave birth were female. There was no male in that room except for my husband on FaceTime. I'm not into like that spiritual thing where it's like, it was super empowering because all the women of the past were there.

Like it, it wasn't like a, a spiritual thing. It was like these women all knew my situation. They all knew that I was essentially by myself other than my best friend. And. They were so supportive of me and it was like they rallied around me and they respected what I wanted. They loved my birth plan. They were, they gave it to me as much as they were able to.

And they, it was empowering to be with women who wanted to see me succeed in such a hard moment in my life. And I had amazing nurse, uh, one uneducated nurse. When I first got there, all of my nurses were amazing. And just so supportive and I mean, like I get exhausted telling the [01:30:00] story a little bit because it was so exhausting even in that moment, but it was like the Lord.

I always think of Hagar where she's in the desert and she's like. There's nothing for me out here. I've been rejected by Abraham. I've been sent out into the wilderness to die essentially. And we're going to die of hunger and thirst. And she separates from Ishmael and the angel of the Lord shows up. And he's like, I'm the God who sees.

And that's what I felt like. I felt like God saw me and he was taking care of me. And it was. Like, I don't know if everyone will experience that, that kind of tangible knowing that God's caring for you and seeing it work out. But I was able to experience it and it was just amazing in, in such a dark time.

It was, it was. this bright light from the Lord. And it was like, everything's awful, but we're going to make it so good, even in the midst of all of that. [01:31:00]

Kayla: Yeah. I love your perspective on that. I love that you were able to focus on the good because I mean, in our flesh, I feel like it would be so easy just to focus on the fact that you weren't having a home birth and you, yeah, your husband wasn't there and you were no longer, you know, having the natural birth and all the things like, yeah, that would've been really easy to focus on that part of it.

But instead, you focused on the grace of the Lord and the blessings of the Lord and all of the good things that he was providing amidst. that horrible situation. Wow.

Emilie: I struggled that week that I was at my grandparents house with my daughter and my dad. I struggled because I was praying, you know, please let Jordan make it for the birth.

And, um, And I grieved that week too. So in the midst of praying for what I wanted, I was also grieving and making my, and forcing myself to realize [01:32:00] it may, it probably is not going to turn out the way that you want. So you kind of need to be comfortable with it. So I was angry for sure. But I also knew I didn't have any other choice, essentially.

I mean, I just didn't. And it was one of those situations where I had so little control over what was going to happen to me. But again, I think praying changes your perspective and asking the Lord for what I want and not getting what I wanted still ended up being a blessing. Um, because the Lord through that prayer that I prayed to him was working on my heart to make me okay with what happened.

And do I wish Jordan had been there a hundred percent? I would have been like, so much easier to know that my partner was able, like able to physically hold me for certain things. Hannah, my best friend is so short. So there's just like very little things that she could do for me. But, um, we just walked and walked and walked.

But, um You know, I would have loved to have had a more strong support, [01:33:00] physically supportive person there, but I had so much support in so many other ways. I didn't have support to have a home birth with my family, which was fine. They weren't prepared for it. That's not their wheelhouse. That's not their, um, niche for them.

That was me. And, um, so it worked out okay, but I had, I had Ellen, I had Hannah, I had my sister, I had my mom, I had my nurses, I had a midwife, and I had a hospital system that was pretty comfortable with me, even in the midst of COVID doing what I wanted to do. And so I had support. It just didn't look like how I thought it would or how I planned for it to be.

Kayla: So you mentioned earlier something about Whole30 and nursing your second and food, like, what Tell me about that. I've been like curious as to what you're gonna say about that.

Emilie: Okay, so, um, with my first, I had an amazing nursing relationship with her. It worked. Like from the moment we started nursing, her latch was amazing.

Everything worked great. [01:34:00] But the summer before I gave birth to my son, I was on Instagram and I don't know if you follow muscles and motherhood, Margaret is her name. She's an amazing follow so much education. Um, but she talked about her own.

And I remember thinking, huh, I was like, I knew what a tongue tie was, but it was just not very talked about

Kayla: until recently, and so

Emilie: I remember just being really interested in what she was saying. And then I remember having the thought, which I think was from the Lord saying, like, I think I need to pay attention to these because I think my baby's going to have a tongue tie.

And it was like, The Lord just prepared me. And so with my second, I did not eat whole 30. I had allowed myself to have milk because I had read about the brewer's diet. Um, it was not raw milk, but it was whole milk. Um, and also I did not [01:35:00] want to relive the whole 30 experience and being hungry. And with my firstborn, I remember one time I had gone shopping and I had such a bad pregnancy brain that all I bought was chicken thighs and bell peppers.

And that's all we had for dinner. for a week was chicken thighs and bell peppers. And I was like, I can't do that again. I've got a three year old now and it's just not going to work out to be only eating bell peppers for a week. And so I did not eat as clean. I allowed myself to have more processed food and I allowed myself to have more snacks, um, more grains and breads and, Milk and things like that.

I didn't feel bad. My blood pressure was fine. Like both pregnancies, it was fine. My, um, gestational diabetes tests were both normal. In fact, I don't, I didn't do one for the second. They just monitored my blood glucose with everything. And so, um, everything was just super normal for both pregnancies. The only difference was my diet changes.

And then when my son was born, I remember looking at his mouth, um, while he was crying within an [01:36:00] hour of giving birth to him. And I remember looking at his mouth and I was like, he's got a tongue tie. He's for sure got a tongue tie. And I, it was to the very tip of his tongue. And it, um, I could just see that his tongue function was not where it was supposed to be.

So I put him on my, my breast, but I put him on my right breast, which has a smaller nipple than my left breast. Just worked out that way, I guess when God made me. And so, um, I put him on my right breast and it was okay. It was uncomfortable. It was not, it was different completely from my firstborn. Um, and so we get back to mother and baby and out of the labor and delivery section into my own room.

And, um, My milk is not coming in as fast as it had come in with my first. They're like, well, you just had COVID. Like you just had this really difficult experiences. And I was like, yeah, but I'm pretty in control of my body. And if I like, I wanted to make milk and I was like, like doing everything that I could just mentally to get my body to release [01:37:00] milk and I knew it was not working and I knew it wasn't because of my body, I knew it was because of his oral function.

And so. What we see, a little bit of a nerd tangent, but what we see with oral function is that the cleaner and less processed you eat, the wider your mouth is, the less instances you have of oral ties and you have better oral function altogether, by and large.

Kayla: You mean the pregnant mother, what they're eating when they're pregnant with a baby?

Or you mean like, like kids and babies when they eat food, what do you mean?

Emilie: Both and it's a both and okay, so what we see is that if the parents eat mostly largely unprocessed diet The kids have better oral function But also what they eat will determine how wide their palates grow and if they have crooked teeth or not And so what you see is it's it's a both and of do the parents eat clean do the kids eat whole foods Um, that's why baby lid weaning is [01:38:00] really important is you can give your baby some steak and they start that chewing process, which helps them widen their palates, helps their teeth to grow in.

It's a whole complicated issue that I can't really explain. Cause I'm not as I'm educated on it for myself to enough to make a decision for myself, but as far as like, I couldn't be a tongue tie doctor or revisionist or things like that, or a myofunctional therapist, but I know enough to know that What the mother eats directly affects the DNA of the baby in utero.

And I learned that in college. Actually, I went to a private Christian school in college and my biology teacher was like, what a mom does while she's pregnant, even if she hadn't done anything prior to pregnancy, like exercise or eating clean, what she does in pregnancy will determine the DNA because it's all proteins will determine the DNA of what that baby is predetermined predisposed to be like.

So if the mom. is overweight, but eats healthy and exercises during pregnancy. The baby [01:39:00] in her body is predisposed to be fit and healthy and not overweight so that it does change your DNA in utero. And so I know personally, I believe I don't, I can't verify it. I'm not a scientist, but I personally believe that because I ate so clean with my daughter, it allowed her to have better oral function.

Bye! And also I didn't have an epidural with her. And so I definitely think that played a part into how awake she was to willing now know that she does have oral ties, but she was able to work past those within that first week. And actually first day, cause it was so easy with her, with my son, I didn't need as clean and, um, his oral ties, he had buckle ties, which is in your cheeks.

And he had a lip tie and he had a tongue tie. He had four oral ties and they were, he was not able to stick his tongue out when he was crying. And even my husband noticed, um, which he doesn't do as much research as I do. That's just how his way. But for [01:40:00] me, I do a ton of research and for him to notice and reaffirm what I was saying, I was like, okay, I'm not crazy.

So I do think my diet with my first is, played a part in my daughter's oral function for nursing and the same for my son just in a more negative way. Because it was very clear we got his tongue tie revised and he was finally able to stick his tongue out and make the suckling motion so much easier.

Kayla: Yeah,

Emilie: so it was just it was just night and day.

Kayla: How old was he when you got his tongue revised or his tie revised?

Emilie: I think he was about a month old because we started two weeks prior to him, or no, he was about a month and a half old because around a month is when we took him in and they were like, yeah, he's got four oral ties.

They're really severe. We've got to get these taken care of, come back next week. So we spent a week to 10 days, uh, doing stretches with his mouth, getting him used to having our fingers in his mouth for stretches so his tie wouldn't [01:41:00] reattach. Right. Um, we used a laser and we went to the tongue tie laser center of Atlanta and they use a laser to do the revision, which I was more comfortable with because it cauterizes immediately and it heals faster.

Um, So it was, it was a process. And then that was, it was like, I don't know if you've experienced this with breastfeeding, but that trilling motion that they make with their tongues when they're nursing, like they're not actively nursing, but it's like, they're about to start. Sucking and it's that little weighty motion with your tongue.

My son had never done that when nursing with me, my daughter had. And I was so, because I was so familiar with a good breastfeeding relationship with my daughter, I was like, something's not working right. Like he's not having that. And my letdowns were really fast. We did discover that I have a really fast letdown.

Um, but after the revision, he, he finally made that trilling motion with his tongue. It only happened once, [01:42:00] but it at least did improve things. And he was able to stick his tongue out now. Um, but that, that relates back to my milk supply in the mother and baby, the nurse that was in charge of my room. I said, man, my milk, my milk supply is not coming in.

And she was like, well, you've had all these issues. I can get you a hand pump. She got me a Medela hand pump. And I don't know if you ever used a Medela hand pump, but they have the section of Absolutely nothing. And I was like, ma'am, this, this pan pumps doing nothing for me. I said, I need a, like an industrial size, Mandela, like a double electric.

Kayla: Yeah.

Emilie: I said, I need an electric pump. Were you not having any

Kayla: colostrum coming out?

Emilie: Barely any. I mean, it was just drips. It was barely anything. I was like, he's getting hungry. You were

Kayla: used to having a lot more.

Emilie: Yeah. And, and he, he was nine pounds, four ounces, and they were worried about his blood sugar and they were doing the blood sugar tests and the hospital and everything.

And so I. He [01:43:00] was, I knew he was getting next to nothing with me. And so I let them give him some formula because I was like, I'm going to figure out my breast milk supply, but he can have formula in the meantime while I'm figuring out, and we still worked on nursing and everything, but I said, ma'am, I need an electric pump.

To get my milk to come in. I said, as soon as you give me that electric pump, my milk supply is going to come in and I just knew it. And she said, well, those are reserved for the neonatals. Um, so I would have to get it approved by a doctor. I said, okay, go, go get it approved. She says, well, you know, that's a last resort for us.

That would be like, that's just not something that's priority. I said, ma'am, my, my breast milk is not coming in. You need to go get me that. Okay, well, I'll go ask the doctor like she just everything was just so she was very resistant to everything was very kind and how she said everything it was almost annoying how kind she was.

Um, and I knew that she knew her stuff. It was clear to me that she was a smart woman, but at the same time, it was just. [01:44:00] Like pulling teeth to get anything done that I wanted to get done for her or for my son with her. And so I never got the electric pump at the hospital, but he had managed his blood sugar had, had been fine.

And so they sent me home. And so my husband did make it the next day after the labor, he made it on Sunday and he did get to meet our son in person that, that night. And then he took me home the next day. Um, and so we get home that night, that afternoon, evening, and I'm breastfeeding that whole day and I'm like, he's getting more lethargic.

throughout the day. Like, it's just clear to me that my milk is not, it's still like it's better, but it's still not where it needs to be. And I was like, mom, I need you to just look, cause that was at my mom's house. Because again I don't have a house at this point I'm living with my grandma and grandpa.

But I went to my mom's house right after leaving the hospital. And um, I said, Mom, like, what are you thinking? Because I, I'm, [01:45:00] I'm an emotional wreck. Worried that my baby's going to die, essentially, because my milk is not coming in how it should, or it normally would. And she said, Ellie, I really think you need to go get a pump.

And I said, okay, I'll go get a pump. Thankfully we had money from selling our house and, um, I didn't have to worry about the cost of everything. Like it was just, again, another way the Lord took care of us. And so my brother, I said, okay, mom, here's a bottle. Cause we still had formula from the hospital.

They sent us home with formula and a little, this little neonatal, yeah, little tiny one nipple. Little tiny bottles I said mom and Jordan you guys watch the baby because I knew at least if anything happened My husband was with him and my mom was with him and my mom's like a baby whisperer So I was like, he's gonna be fine and I knew what I wanted to go get so my brother took me to Target I'm an emotional wreck at this point like just

Kayla: well.

Yeah, you're like probably peak baby [01:46:00] blue

Emilie: Yeah. And, and baby blues hit me pretty hard that first week and a half. So just, I think my body cycles through those hormones really fast. So I get really intense baby blues, but as soon as it's done, it's done for me. So that, that day I was just like. My brother takes me to Target, and he's just so caring for me, and he's, I want to say he was 19 or 20 at the time, taking his first postpartum brother to Target to go get a breast pump and more formula to have on hand, and bottles, like everything.

I didn't have anything with me because it was all in storage. And. was like, okay, what do we need to do? What do we need? What can I get for you? Like, and he's just trying to be helpful. And I said, I just need to go to the mother and baby section in target. And so we'd go to target. I picked up a, not Medela.

I was like, I'm done with Medela. It was the, Oh, I picked up a spectrum because I had done research on the spectrum pumps. And at the time they had legendary milk [01:47:00] supplements. I was like, I'm getting this milk supply down. Like, we're going to figure it out. So I got the spectrum pump. I got the bottles.

legendary milk supplies. And then I got like all these breastfeeding things. And then I got bottles and formula and we get back. And my mom was like, he ate that bottle up. Like he was hungry. He was so hungry and they didn't give him more than I think two ounces, but he ate all of it. He was just starving.

And that's why he would have been so lethargic is because nothing was coming out. And so I went home that night. With the formula with the bottles, all this stuff, the pump, I set up the pump. The first thing that I got back that night, and we were living with my grandma and grandpa at the time and they had room for us, but the only room they had for us was in what essentially was meant to be a game room with a bathroom attached to it, like we would put a pool table in it and it had a bed and everything, but it's a smaller room.

And so it's one queen size bed. [01:48:00] There's a couch in there. And my grandma's a stuffed person, so she had a lot of stuff in there, but it was just this cramped and tiny room. And I was like, this is going to be my pumping station. And it was an old bar chair, just like, like a seventies bar chair that I put next to a nightstand and it had a bookshelf next to it.

I set it up, I got it working and I said, babe, you hold the baby. He's asleep right now. I just need you to hold him while I pump. And as soon as I started that electric pump, my milk. I'm that like flying through that machine. Like it just needed a better section that I didn't know at the time, but my son couldn't give me a better section because of his oral ties.

And so as soon as I had that good section, and my milk was just coming out. And I sent a picture of the bottles to my mom. I was like, I knew that nurse was dumb because she was not giving me the electric pump. I said, I knew that if I just had an electric pump, my milk would have come in. And she's like, well, I'm glad that you've got it now.

It's like, it all worked out. But I just, when you know your body, you really need [01:49:00] to. Advocate for yourself. And I don't know, just be familiar with your body and know what your body is like. And I can't say that enough because it's always my advice to women is just know what your body is like. Be comfortable with your body.

If you're uncomfortable with it, learn how to get comfortable and learn what To track your signs. I don't even track my period super strictly. I'm more of like, oh, I think this is about time. Like I'm noticing things about myself or I'm getting cranky. Like, Oh, okay. I'm probably going to start my period next week.

Just learn your body and just anything that you can do to be more comfortable with how your body functions will serve you so much. When you get into situations like birth where you're like. My milk's not coming in, but it should be here. Like it just needs help, you know, and I wish I had been a little bit more insistent with that nurse because then I wouldn't have had that scary moment where my son was lethargic and my milk would have come in at that point, you know.

It all worked out, but just, yeah, [01:50:00] it was just such a weird story with my milk coming in and stuff. So,

Kayla: so did he go on to nurse well after his ties were released?

Emilie: He nursed better and I got connected with an IBCLC, um, who was so helpful. And I, he, even after his tongue tie revision, I was trying to nurse on both sides, but my left breast was just.

It's too big for him. My nipple was too big for his mouth, even with the tongue tie release. And that's why I say what you eat determines what your baby has. Cause his palate was so narrow because I had not eaten as well. And so I think if he had had a wider palate, he could have taken in more of my breasts.

And then better at nursing on that side. But anyway, he, my nipple was incredibly damaged from him on my left side. And I went to the IBS CLC. I was like, can I breastfeed with one breast? And she's like, I have breast cancer patients who have only one [01:51:00] breast at all. And they only nurse and they, they give their baby exactly what they need with just one breast.

I was like, okay, well, I've got two, so I can at least pump on the other side. Um, so that's what I did. I, he would nurse and then I would pump. And I would supplement with formula because his, his function was still not a hundred percent. But again, I was incredibly tired from everything I had been through.

You've been through a lot. Yeah. And I knew the revision was the most important thing. So we did the stretches, we did the exercises, but I've really made peace with the fact that maybe he needed to have formula because he was not getting wet. He needed for my milk. Um, and he wasn't getting what he needed from my milk because my letdown was so fast.

He would fill up on the four milk, which is not as fatty, and he poor, poor kid, just needed that fat that the formula could provide for him. 'cause he wasn't getting it from my breast milk. So for a little while, he was a little skinny baby. And then when I started [01:52:00] supplementing with formula. more regularly.

He fattened up overnight, it seemed like, and it was like what he needed. And he was happier too. So I think it's really important for new moms especially to just Cause when you're a new mom, you just have these ideas and you have these ideals of what you want, and those are all good things to have and you should have them.

But you also need to think what if this doesn't work out the way I needed to or wanted to, and then I think that mental preparation will go so far for you. If it gets to the point where like for me, nothing that I wanted worked out, but I had done the mental preparation. And praying and asking the Lord for, for wisdom that when it didn't work out, it was still okay because I was ready for it.

You know? So I would just say for new moms, like just learn to get okay with not having what you think is the best because we live in a fallen world and because of that breastfeeding doesn't always work out and you do have to [01:53:00] supplement with formula, but babies need formula sometimes and that's okay.

Yeah.

Kayla: Yeah. I want to know how you ended up back in North Carolina. Okay. Cause, well, cause it's like in the beginning you shared, you know, da da da, I live in North Carolina, such and such, and then, but at this end of your story, you were living in Georgia. So I'm like, okay, how'd we get back here?

Emilie: Yeah, so we sold our house in North Carolina and moved to Georgia and we did not intend to live with family as long as we did.

Our goal was to buy a house within six months of living there. We knew that we needed to rest a little bit from all the trauma we had experienced. So we allowed ourself a lot of grace. We went through Christmas and then we were like, okay, let's start looking for houses. The, if you're not from Georgia, you may not understand, but Atlanta controls so much of what that state does.

South of Atlanta, nobody really wants to live South of Atlanta [01:54:00] because one, it's really, really hot. And then two, there's just no industry South of Atlanta, unless you're farming. Um, and so it's really, Like from someone who's from Northeast Georgia, to me, it feels like there's North Georgia and Northeast Georgia, Atlanta, Macon, Florida.

Like that's what it feels like. Cause the rest of Georgia is just farmland. Like everybody forgets about it. Um, and his job was North of Atlanta. And so we knew that we wanted to be close to his job, close to my family. But the problem is that Atlanta, everybody wants to live North of Atlanta because Atlanta is too expensive to live in.

South Georgia is nobody wants to live south of Atlanta. So Northeast Georgia is relatively inexpensive compared to Atlanta. And everybody started moving up there. So with all these people moving out of Atlanta into Northeast Georgia, it got so expensive right as we moved there and we could not get approved for [01:55:00] anything that would actually allow us to afford a house.

Cause I wasn't working at the time. And. Even though we were making more money than we've ever made in our marriage, it was not enough for that housing market. And so we were like, okay, well, I guess we're just going to live with family until we can find something. But the only thing that we were able to afford at the time were all of these really rundown trailers that were clearly a health violation.

Just looking at the pictures and we're like, this is not okay. So, um, I ended up taking a job for an herbal wellness company and that helped us in Georgia, but it's still, the market was so high and so expensive that we couldn't afford to live within 20 minutes of my husband's job. And personally, I believe that if you have to.

Move outside of 20 minute radius from your job. Your company, it's basically asking you to subsidize your employment with having to commute that way. And so it just wasn't working out. And [01:56:00]um, as much as we loved his job, it just wasn't working out to stay there. Um, February of 2023, my husband, um, Was in a car wreck and almost died and, um, that was like a wake up call for us.

We were like, we can't, we can't do this anymore. He fell asleep at the wheel because of, um, sleep apnea, making him so exhausted. And so we got, we got him on a CPAP machine and he sleeps so much better now. It's just like night and day. Um, but he was in a car wreck in February. Um, went through that year trying to find something in Georgia and that the rest of 2023 was just realizing it's not sustainable to live here.

We can't keep living with family. We didn't want to keep living with family, but we can't afford to live in Northeast Georgia. Um, so he started looking around at places outside of [01:57:00] Georgia. He didn't want to, cause he loved his job so much, but it wasn't paying enough for us to live there. So, um, we ended up Finding a job in North Carolina and moved here.

Um, April 1st was when we closed down our house here. So we moved back to the same area.

Kayla: That was like same place. Yeah.

Emilie: Yeah. It, we, we live in Gibsonville now, but we used to be in Burlington.

Kayla: Yeah.

Emilie: Um, so now we're back closer to his family. I'm thankful that we're still close to family. We're just close to his family now.

So it all worked out and we're back here now. Well, welcome back. And that's been my crazy life for the past 40 years.

Kayla: I'm just like, there are so many parts in your story where I was just like on the edge of my seat. I got like really fired up a couple of times, but I really appreciate you sharing everything and all that you've been through and your experiences. I mean, that's, that is. It's a lot.

Emilie: Yeah. I think I still need to [01:58:00] probably go do a little bit of therapy for everything that we've been through in the past four years, because it's been, well, one, there was 2020 and then.

Right. Everyone needed therapy for 2020. Yeah. Oh, for sure. So I think I still would benefit from like talking to a therapist about all that stuff, but the Lord has been really good to walk through it with me and just be there as it is. So. Yeah, it was rough, but God is good.

Kayla: I don't always ask this. I, in fact, I usually don't ask this, so you don't even have to answer if you don't want to.

Okay. Um, but do you foresee your family ever expanding again?

Emilie: Yes. Uh, we would like to have a baby next year. I'm not pregnant currently. We would like to get pregnant within the next year or so and have another baby. So we'll see. I don't know if my body is going to get pregnant as fast as it did the first two times, but it has a good track record, so I'm hopeful.

Kayla: Yeah. Well, that's exciting. I don't want to assume, [01:59:00] but I kind of would assume that you'd want a home birth with your husband there. Oh yeah.

Emilie: Yeah. For sure. Yeah. And for my second, I had, you know, I had planned that home birth and the intention was just to have me and my husband. the photographer and Christian and the midwife there.

And it was just going to be a very quaint thing. Um, so I don't know what it will look like next time. My hope is to have a home birth and just, I don't know, almost sometimes I'm, I'm like, I'll just have an unassisted birth, even like, just like I've experienced. So much that I feel pretty confident in my ability to birth a child by myself, but I think my husband would be more comfortable with a midwife there.

So I'd love to have, yeah, I'd love to have my midwife and birth team that I had originally planned to have. We'll see what happens.

Kayla: Well, thank you so much for coming and sharing. I pray prayers of fertility over you over the next year. And just that you would get [02:00:00] that, that home birth. Cause I know what it's like.

To, you know, want that experience and, and then when you actually get it, like my fourth was my first home birth. And it was, I always say like, besides my wedding day, night, it was like the best night of my life. Like, so, but thank you for everything. This has been awesome.

Emilie: Thank you. It's been really therapeutic to share my birth stories.

Kayla: Thank you so much for listening to today's episode. You can reach me at surrenderedbirthservices on Instagram or email me at contact at surrenderedbirthservices. com. Be sure not to miss an episode by hitting the follow button. Also, we'd love for you to leave a written review of the show so that more people's births and lives can be changed by the love of Jesus and the empowerment of accurate birth education.

If you really enjoyed this episode in particular, Please take a screenshot [02:01:00] of it and post it to your Instagram story tagging Surrendered Birth Services. If you would like to be a guest on the Surrendered Birth Stories podcast, please click the link in the episode show notes to fill out your interest form.

Also, if you're interested in taking my childbirth classes, birth consultations, or having me as your birth doula, please click on the link in the show notes to take you to my website for online and in person options. Just as a reminder, this show is not giving medical advice, so please continue to see your personal care provider as needs arise.

We hope you have a great week, and remember, learn all that you can, make the best plans.

Okay, it's about to cut us off because we have less than a minute left, but I'm like hanging on the edge of my seat because I'm like, what, [02:02:00] who is this doctor and is he still working because yes, he is. Unfortunately. Oh my gosh.

Okay. All right. I'll see you in one second. Okay. My goodness gracious. That is insane.