025 - A Turn Of Events After Three Normal Births (with Travita King)

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Breech birth is a variation of normal. But OB/GYN’s are no longer being taught how to deliver breech babies, they’re simply told to do a c-section, no questions asked. How would you feel if you’d had three successful, natural, vaginal births, and when going into labor with your fourth, he was breech, and the only option they gave you was surgery? Listen in today as Travita shares her birth stories, including her breech delivery.

TRANSCRIPT:

Hi, and welcome to another episode of Surrendered Birth Stories.

Birth Stories, Birth Education, and the Pursuit of Surrendering It All to God.

Let's get started.

Well, happy almost Valentine's Day, everybody.

Not sure if you're a big Valentine's Celebrator or not.

My husband and I have kind of gone up and down through it over the years.

It's like some years, there will be some extravagant gift.

Like one year, he surprised me with this like nighttime date night couples massage, which was so cool.

And then it's like other times, we order takeout and hang out on the couch.

And that's about it.

You know, some years there have been flowers and chocolate and stuff.

And other years, it's like, here is a card and your favorite something.

I don't know.

It's just kind of changed over the years.

Except quick funny story is that when we were dating, he tried to surprise me on this Valentine date by like just doing something out of left field.

And I somehow totally called it.

I was in like a dress and heels and maybe like, I don't know, maybe have like stock ings or something on.

And he's like, guess what?

We're going bowling.

And I was so funny because it was like, I knew we were going bowling before we actually went there.

And then I don't know, it was just funny because I was like in a dress.

And anyways, he was trying to surprise me and somehow I knew it.

I don't know.

I have an intuition about those things.

But you know, the longer you date each other and are married to each other, the easier it is to guess things like that.

But we don't have any extravagant plans for this Valentine's Day, or at least I don't.

So Chris, if you're listening and you have plans for us, that's super exciting and I'm super pumped about it.

We also have a newborn.

Well, I mean, I guess he's like four and a half months old now.

So that's not as much of a newborn, but he's still young.

So it would require pumping and all that fun stuff if I left him.

So anyways, whether you are super pregnant right now at Valentine's Day or you have a newborn or you're wanting to get pregnant or you are already done with that phase of life and your kids are older and whatever season you're in, I hope you have a wonderful Valentine's Day.

All right.

If you have not sent us a question or questions yet for our upcoming Q&A episode, please, please, please, please do.

I'm about to cut off.

I think this is actually the last week we're going to take questions because we're getting ready to record it.

We're actually about to record it.

So if you haven't submitted a question yet, please do.

It's for our six month anniversary episode for this podcast, which is awesome.

And we're doing Q&A so you can ask any questions related to birth and pregnancy, childbirth, I mean like anything in that realm.

You can also ask any questions about faith.

Obviously, we are not, well, I'm not a pastor.

My husband is an ordained pastor, but I'm not, but you know, we'll answer from our hearts and from what we know and from what our journeys have been with the Lord.

And then also, if you have any questions that are just personal about my husband or myself or kids or anything like that, or really just anything personal at all.

So please submit your questions.

You can do it through email to contact at surrenderedbirthservices.com or on Instagram.

If you haven't followed us there yet, go ahead and come and follow us along for the ride.

The handle is Surrendered Birth Services.

So please do that.

We can't wait to see your questions.

We can't wait to answer your questions.

We are pumped about this episode.

It's going to be so much fun.

And then also, if you haven't left us a review yet for this show, please do just pause this.

Pause it right now.

Pause it and go leave a review on whatever platform you're listening on.

It would help us so much.

It would help other people see this podcast who wouldn't see it without all the reviews, the algorithms and all that stuff.

So please leave us a review.

Hopefully a great one.

We love doing this podcast and we just want to make sure to the best of our ability that as many people are able to see it and listen to it as possible so that God can keep working through these stories and changing people's lives for the better.

So breach birth is a variation of normal, but OBGYNs are no longer being taught how to deliver breach babies.

They're simply just told to do a C-section, no questions asked.

How would you feel if you'd had three successful natural vaginal births and when going into labor with your fourth, he was breach and the only option they gave you was surgery?

Listen in today as Travita shares her birth stories, including her breach delivery.

Well, welcome to another episode of Surrendered Birth Stories.

I am your host, Kayla Heater, and I am excited to have a guest in person with me today.

We've done a lot of Zoom interviews lately, but you are right here in my, I want to say studio, in my closet with me, my closet studio.

And it's so fun because I can see you.

I mean, I see people on Zoom face-to-face, but it's nice to like, I can touch, I can reach over and touch your hand, which is great.

So why don't you go ahead and introduce yourself, tell us who you are, what your life is like, and let us get to know you.

Well, my name is Travita King, and I have four children, ages 15.

13, 11, and 9.

Yes, and we have a very busy life with school and all the things, all the things.

We used to home school, and so sometimes I'm like, oh, I wish we could stay home instead of packing our lunch and trying to hurry out the door, so yeah, it's good.

And you also bake, right?

I do bake.

I'm a baker.

I was trained to bake breakfast pastries, like cinnamon rolls and strudel and danish and cake and all the things, and so I do that kind of on the side.

And then during the day, I'm actually a teacher assistant at a private Christian school.

So you can all go to school together.

Yes, we can all be together, which I love.

It's nice because they can come by the room or get what they need.

I can watch over them and see what they're doing.

That's so cool.

Yeah, that's good.

Wow, 15, I think when I met you, I mean, they were all elementary school and some of them were toddler.

So like, I can't even imagine that.

Yes.

And he is about to do driver's ed next week.

So I'm like, I guess I should get you in the car so you know how to turn it on.

He'll learn.

He'll learn.

So we're going to talk about these four sweet babies who are all so much older now.

We're going to talk about their births.

So let's tell me about your first pregnancy, getting pregnant for the first time.

I was so excited.

I remember my husband and myself, we were not good at the birth control.

So I couldn't remember to take the pills, and then we never had anything else.

So we had been married only like six months, and then I found out I was pregnant.

I'm thinking back, you kind of just know.

I mean, because if you're in a rhythm with how your body is, you're kind of like, something's off, let me see.

And so, yeah, I saw that I was pregnant on a little stick, and he was at work, so I think I made a little video and sent it to him.

Because I don't think there was Skype or anything like that.

That was back before.

Yeah, so I think I sent the little video to him.

And so we were very excited, yeah.

It was an exciting time.

It was kind of like, oh, okay, you know, let's see what that's going to mean.

So, yeah, just us in a little one bedroom apartment, that's it.

Did you know where you were going to have care for that pregnancy?

Like, had you thought at all about what kind of birth you wanted or any of that at all?

Oh, me too, girl.

I mean, I was petrified of needles, and that was kind of like my worst nightmare.

It's like, oh no, from all I've seen on TV, you know, they make it seem really bad.

So I knew I didn't want to do that, like an epidural or any of that.

But there are lots of other needles that they like to give you besides an epidural.

Oh, yeah.

So yeah, I knew I wanted like a more natural birth.

And so because of that, I kind of was doing some research, and I found hypnobirthing.

And so that is the approach that I took for that one, the first one.

I did all the things.

I had a little button that says, like, what did it say?

Don't ask me about my pain or something like that.

And actually, you know, 15 years ago, really having a natural birth with no pain medicine was like, you're crazy.

Like, I got a lot of that.

Even more unheard of.

Yes, it was very unheard of, very much like foreign concept.

So I even remember when I had my shower, my baby shower, at my mom's house.

And yeah, I was wearing my little button saying, you know, kind of essentially, leave me alone.

You know, I'll have the kind of birth I want to have.

And yeah, they were just like, no, Aberdural, no, you can't do it.

I would never do it.

And so some of that kind of freaked me out a little bit, just because I wasn't sure what to expect.

But I think it was fine.

It was fine.

So I would listen to my CDs that they give you, and it was not hypnosis.

It was more like just relaxation.

Right.

And so you're just relaxing yourself and that sort of thing.

And so I would like memorize scripture or pray and just ask the Lord to help me and help me to be okay with how my body is meant to be.

And that's kind of how I went into it.

And I went to a practice that was very traditional, but they did have midwives.

So and I was trying to think about what the name of that practice was.

I have to look it up.

But I remember the midwife was Vicki Latham.

Okay, yeah, I think that's, oh gosh, CC...

Yeah, it's with a C.

Central.

Central Carolina.

Yes.

And she was my midwife the whole time.

Now, toward the end, they would split you up, you know what I mean?

They would say, oh, she might not be available.

You might have to get this other midwife.

But I was pretty much seeing midwives.

And they were, for the most part, okay with my decisions to be natural.

I think most of them in the back of their mind are like, yeah, we'll see, kind of.

We'll see how far you get kind of thing.

But I went into labor, and how that happened was I was in the dead of sleep, and my water broke.

Yes, I was just...

You woke up to water.

Yes, I woke up, and I was like, oh, and you know, it's kind of a weird feeling.

And so I was like, oh, that, I can't control that.

So my water broke, oh my gosh, we can go to the hospital, yay.

And so we had our little bag, and we just drove to the hospital.

Did you have any contractions yet?

I think, no, I don't think so.

I know, now prior to this, I had had these Brexton Hicks contractions.

So I had had those, but like when my water broke, it wasn't immediately.

You weren't like in labor.

No, but I didn't know that.

But you went to the hospital.

But I went to the hospital.

And...

Rookie mistake, Travita, rookie mistake.

Yes, yes.

And so I was there a very long time.

I bet you were.

Yes.

I want to say from start to finish, it was about 16 hours.

Well, then that's not too long.

Yeah.

I know some people are like...

37, 48, 50 hours.

Yeah.

So it was about 16 hours, and I did...

Yeah.

I didn't have a doula.

I don't even know if I knew what a doula was at the time, but...

So what happened was it was time to push, and, you know, they want you to get on your back to push.

Wait, so you went in there, you eventually started having contractions.

Did they have to give you pitocin or anything, or did you just...

No, I knew I didn't want that.

So your labor just eventually picked up?

Yep.

So you weren't hooked up to any needles?

I had an IV.

It's almost like, you have to have an IV.

Of fluids, or was it just a head block?

I don't remember.

Was there a bag hanging next to you, like a pole?

Yeah, I think it was just fluids.

Okay.

Yeah, I think it was just fluids.

There was nothing like medicine or anything like that.

Just fluids.

Yeah.

And I was hooked up to that.

So you were still all natural?

I was still all natural.

Look at you, just you and your husband.

Yep.

No one else was there.

Nobody else was there.

And he was good because I had a lot of back labor.

And he was having to push so hard on my back to where it was hurting his hand.

I've been there as a doula.

I have pushed on many a back.

It's hard.

So hard, yeah.

I can imagine.

And so, yeah, things kind of progressed over time.

And she told me that.

Okay, so she told you it was time to push.

Yes.

You didn't know it was time to push.

No.

I just knew that it was progressively getting like, no.

Not that I don't want the baby, but I was just like, is there another way?

Is there another way out of this?

Very difficult.

So how long did you push for?

I don't remember.

But it wasn't very long.

Like, I know some people have to push like a super long time.

Like a few hours.

Yeah, but no.

This was under an hour.

Yeah, this was like, push, you know.

Maybe three times she said it.

Oh, shoot.

Yeah.

It was pretty fast.

Yeah.

So as a result of that, I tore, okay.

I think at the end, like she was trying to say, you know, slow down, slow down, slow down, slow down.

But I tore.

And then, so then I had to get stitches.

Yeah.

Which was terrible.

That was worse than pushing the baby out.

Yeah.

And I was getting really upset about that.

I bet.

Yeah.

Well, Ian, this is what I tell some clients is like, natural birth, so great.

All the hormones, the high, like everything's great.

But if you have to get stitched up and you don't have an epidural, that's harder than laboring and pushing out a baby without an epidural.

Absolutely.

It's quite the challenge.

Yeah.

I was just like, what are you doing and can you finish quickly?

I know.

Yes.

And then they have to, well, I don't know if they have to, but they pushed on my stomach.

And so I'm like, so then your stomach's cramping so bad.

And then they're stitching you at the same time, asking you a billion questions.

It was a lot.

You kind of felt out of control.

You know what I mean?

At that point, you did kind of take over.

Was baby, was he on your chest though?

At that time, they-

Oh, back then they probably took him away right away.

They take him and they give him a bath and all the shots.

And they do all the dupes in the eyes and all the things before they ever even hand him to you.

Yep.

So then eventually they bring him back and everything.

But then they don't want you to sleep.

Well, they're constantly interrupting you, so you can't sleep.

And so-

And then they don't want you to sleep holding the baby.

So you just don't sleep, because you want to hold your baby.

Yes.

But for the most part, I would call that a positive experience.

Right.

It doesn't sound like anything super dramatic happened.

Nothing.

No.

So I did feel like when it was time to push, it was kind of like an out of body experience.

It was like my body is doing something, but my brain, I don't want any part of it.

Like, I don't want to see, I don't want to...

And I think I was even like, no, I don't want any part of whatever is happening.

Get me out of here.

And so I felt like with the next one, I was like, okay, I was not mentally present for that experience, and a lot of things were happening.

And so with the next one, I'm going to try to be like more present.

Do things to be more present.

So what did you do to be more present?

Well, I still was doing...

I still was pretty active with the hypnobirthing and was getting more, I felt like, in charge of like, okay, I know what to expect now.

I know kind of what my body is telling me to do.

I had a different midwife.

The day of...

Well, let me back up.

So I got pregnant with the second one.

That one was kind of on purpose, too.

Because I guess if you don't do anything to prevent it, you're doing it on purpose.

This is kind of on purpose.

Yeah, you're doing it on purpose.

So we got pregnant with...

This is my daughter.

And so we were so excited.

She was a girl.

We were like, wow, we got a boy first.

Now we're getting a girl.

It's so great.

It's so wonderful.

But then I developed as a pregnant woman tachycardia.

Which is the fast heartbeat where you feel like you're going to pass out all the time.

And so that was a challenge.

Because how old was your son at that point when you were pregnant with your daughter?

He was like one.

So, yeah, we just kind of stayed home.

Can't really walk that far.

Yeah, I just remember constantly feeling like, okay, I'm going to fall over if I don't sit down.

Did your midwife do anything for that?

Or did she have to send you to a different specialist?

I did go to a specialist.

I did have a heart monitor for a little bit of time just so they could see how severe it was or whatever.

I'm trying to remember if they put me on medication for that.

I don't think they did.

I think it was just kind of like, oh, yeah, stinks for you.

You know, kind of thing.

And then I remember this baby was born at Thanksgiving, okay?

So I remember the time got closer to deliver, and I didn't say this, but the last baby was on time.

Like 40 weeks.

Like 40 weeks.

So now to this one, I remember we're getting close to the time.

I'm like, okay, I need to be doing all the things.

So I'm having all the pineapple, all the spicy food, all the walking.

And she was breech for a really long time.

Because, you know, when you get to a certain point, it's like, oh, too bad they're breech.

You need to have a c-section kind of a thing, at least back then.

I don't know what they're doing now.

It depends on who you see.

And so I remember just praying, asking the Lord, please let this baby turn around.

And I think I was like looking up, how can you get your baby to turn naturally, you know?

And so I was doing all the weird positions at home.

Getting on an ironing board and flipping yourself over a couch.

Doing like the polar bear thing, whatever.

I could think of to get her to turn.

And she actually did.

It was really miraculous, because it was that day of my ultrasound.

Oh.

And she had turned.

And I felt it when it happened.

And I was like, oh, I think she turned around.

And she did.

And she got engaged.

Because when she was born, actually, she was only, she was little, like six pounds.

Yeah, that is small.

So that's probably why she could just turn around.

Flip, yeah.

And so I remember I was doing all the walking, all the things.

Nothing happened.

I went to the hospital.

I was starting to have contractions with her.

And you were around 40 weeks?

Yes.

And I started having contractions.

This time I had my friend come over and kind of be with me.

And we know I did the bath at home because I stayed at home longer this time.

There you go.

So I stayed at home.

I was having all the contractions, you know.

I'm trying to...

We weren't timing them, but...

So we go to the hospital and then...

You, your husband, and your friend?

Me, my husband, and my friend.

And they sent us home.

Somebody was watching my son.

My friend, another friend.

Because my family is all out of state.

So another friend watched him.

And so we went to the hospital, and things kind of stopped and slowed, and so they sent us home.

So we all went to sleep.

My friend was sleeping on the couch.

Next day, same kind of thing, just these crampy, like, contractions, you know.

So kind of like a prodromal labor that kind of starts, and you think it's going somewhere, and then it stops.

But then finally we went to the hospital, and the midwife decided, well, we'll keep you in triage.

To see if it goes anywhere.

To see if it goes anywhere.

So we're in triage, and I'm still having pretty strong contractions in triage, and I'm just like, but you're sitting in that chair.

There's no bed or anything, so.

Oh, you didn't even have a bed in your triage room?

No.

Oh, wow.

No.

So it was terrible.

That was terrible.

And so my friend was in there with me.

My husband worked late night shifts, so he was in the lobby.

And so finally they gave us a room, and I got into the bath, because my contractions were pretty heavy and consistent and strong and everything.

And so I get into the bath, and all of a sudden it was like, I jump out of the bath, so I'm like, oh, I think the baby's coming.

And I was like, you know, get the doctor or the nurse or whoever, and the doctor kind of like, she doesn't know the baby's not coming.

This is only her second baby, and the baby can't be coming.

So she kind of just...

Right, because you had kind of just gotten there, right?

Like into that room and stuff.

Yeah, I wasn't in there for very long, but I had done most of the labor in the triage room.

In the triage room.

Poor you.

And so I got in there, got into the bath, and I was like, oh, popped out of there, got into the bed.

The doctor strolled in there, la-ze-fair.

And the baby, she didn't even have time to put her little outfit on.

And the baby just kind of shut out.

I was lying on my side.

And again, it's not like I pushed.

It was just kind of like...

That was like the fetal ejection reflex.

Yes.

This is what my body is doing.

And she was still in her sack.

Oh, you had an uncle?

She was still in her sack.

And because now my husband saw and my friend saw, but because I just was disconnected, I didn't see her.

Because I'm assuming the doctor popped it like right as soon as she was out.

Mm-hmm.

So no pictures of that.

Maybe we'll see it in heaven.

I know.

I always think about that.

I'm like, well, I missed that on Earth, but maybe I'll see it in heaven.

So that was kind of exciting.

So your first labor was 16 hours.

When this one actually started, so don't count the prodromal labor.

When this one was like, for real deal, okay, this is it, this is happening.

How long was it the second time around?

I would probably say like four hours.

Yeah.

So a lot shorter.

Yeah, it was about four hours, because by the time you get there, get plugged up, you know.

And your water hadn't broken, so you probably had a little more cushion on your side.

Yes, and so it wasn't as us intense, yeah.

Because when your water breaks, forget about it.

Uh-huh.

It's a whole different feeling.

Yes, yes, it's very different.

And she just kind of, and she was so little.

She just kind of shot right out.

Shot right out.

Yep, she did.

And I was on my side, and it was wonderful.

Little chocolate baby.

So how, I mean, we didn't really talk about this with your son, but did you breastfeed them?

I did.

Wow, that was tough.

Nice to talk about that a little bit.

Yeah, with my son, I was determined to breastfeed, but it was not easy.

I had to use that shield, that nipple shield, which I know is helpful, but wow, that's painful.

Yeah.

Yeah, it was very painful.

And we had to do that, I think, for two weeks.

Oh, the shield.

The shield.

Yeah.

So was he able to go off the shield then?

He was eventually.

Oh, that's good.

And he was my one child that would never take a pass, he'd never take a bottle.

I had one of those.

Yes.

So he was like...

It was me all the time.

All the time.

I could only be gone like four hours.

Oh gosh, that's still a long time to be gone.

Well, I didn't do it often.

It was like when my parents came to visit or whatever, it's like, oh, let's go shopping or whatever.

And he would scream and scream, you know, they say, like, oh, they'll take the bottle eventually or whatever.

No.

No.

He was not having it.

So, and I nursed him until he was one.

And so that's how that went with him.

And then my daughter, I also nursed her, and she didn't need the shield or anything.

She was a great nurser.

She ate great.

We did start to notice that she was really red, like red face, red skin, kind of.

And so we were trying to figure that out, and we got a blood test, and we found that she was allergic to eggs.

And my sister was visiting me for like two weeks, and she did feed me a lot of eggs every day, omelets.

It was delicious.

But we couldn't, we didn't figure that out, you know, at that time.

Is she still allergic to eggs to this day?

Not anymore.

There's hope.

Yes.

She grew out of it.

Yep.

And so then once she grew out of it, they said, okay, she needs to kind of keep that in her diet.

Yeah.

You know, pretty consistently.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, I'm glad nursing was easier for her.

Yeah, it was.

And then when she was about 10 months, I found out I was pregnant.

Now that one doesn't sound so planned.

Right.

With another boy.

And I was like, how is this possible?

You know what I mean?

I just was like, I thought you had to be done.

Done, done, nursing.

Yeah.

No, you don't.

I know some people who exclusively breastfeed and their kids breastfeed all day long, like eight to 12 times a day, and they still get pregnant.

Really?

So just a little advice for those of you out there nursing, not guaranteed birth control by any means at all.

I mean, it works for some people, but you don't know if it's gonna work for you or not until you try it.

Yeah.

Okay, so it didn't work for you.

So it did not work for me.

Ten months in.

Now, do you get sick in your pregnancies at all, or are you pretty okay?

I mean, you had the tachycardia thing the second time, but-

Yes.

I was sick with the first one.

And not with the others?

He was the only one that was like, I really remember like, wow, I was really sick with, like, I would just be do, do, do, do, do, and then projectile vomit.

Oh, yeah.

Like, and just nauseous and just not feeling good.

Yeah.

But with, he was really the only one that I remember.

So I figure I'm sick with the others, but just-

Yeah, it's like, I don't know.

You know?

And then the other thing that I want to say that was an issue that I had after my first, you know, they put you on stool softener, right?

I think that's what it is, a stool colase.

Colase.

Mm-hmm.

So they put me on this colase.

Well, she didn't tell me like when to start it, when to stop.

So you just kept on taking it?

Yeah.

Actually, what happened was they didn't tell me anything.

And so I got so like constipated.

Well, wait, on the colase?

Okay, this is before colase.

Sorry.

And this is during pregnancy?

No.

This is postpartum.

Sorry.

I'm all over the place.

You're good.

I got very constipated.

And so I gave myself an enema.

Uh-huh.

Yes.

Yes, that's exactly what happened.

That's exactly what happened.

And this is after you've already had so much trauma.

So, and that was with that one.

But I'll tell you another story where I had the opposite happen.

With the colase.

So, I'll get there.

But anyway, back to number three.

I'm pregnant.

Mm-hmm.

And I'm like, what in the world?

And you have a two-year-old and a ten-month-old?

Yes.

And I'm like, okay.

And that pregnancy actually was probably the best one in terms of how I felt.

Now, with that one, I felt humongous.

Like, I just felt so big.

And I was.

Because that turned out to be, he was the biggest baby that I had.

I had to go through a lot of the heat.

He was born in May, so I felt...

Oh, you didn't have to go through too much heat.

Well, what did I say?

I was like, ooh, I never want to be super big and go through summer.

That's the worst.

Oh, when you have a fall baby.

Have a, like, a September baby.

Yes.

Yeah.

Oh, yeah, that's when I cut off all my hair.

When I had the baby in October, I was like, nope, can't do that.

But that was a good one.

And so it's kind of uneventful.

I just kind of went through my pregnancy and...

Did he come out at 40 weeks?

He did not.

And this one, my mother had planned to come down.

I thought he was coming at 40 weeks because we knew he was bigger, but he actually stayed another week.

Sounds like the big baby.

Yes, he did.

Big baby would do something like that.

Yes, he stayed another week, and by this, I had wised up and got a doula.

Although, I mean, it sounds like you did the first two just fine on your own, but it's nice to have.

It's nice to have, like, the support.

I was figuring out that my spouse does not do well with blood or anything.

Or anything.

Or anything bodily functions.

Anything bodily function.

So I found that out over time.

By the second one, I was like, okay, I need a friend.

I need a friend.

And so I had another friend that came the third time.

So I get into labor, okay, and it's me, my spouse, my friend, the doula.

I want to say I had two friends in there.

Wow.

Yeah.

Sounds like a party.

Yeah, it was kind of like a party.

And your mom, did your mom stay with your other kids?

Yes, my mom stayed with my other kids.

And so everything was going fine, but then they were like, well, you need to put this oxygen on your face.

Huh.

Because you need to get more oxygen.

The baby is looking distressed or whatever, you need to get more oxygen.

And I was about through a fit, because I'm very like minimalistic, okay, with the whole delivery.

It's like, stop trying to control me and tell me all the things that...

Don't touch me.

Don't touch me.

Yeah.

And so they're like, you're going to put this mask on your face.

So I put the mask on, and I was in a lot of pain, but they were like, you need to push the baby out.

He's kind of big.

And so...

And everyone's like yelling at me, because by this point, the midwife is in there, but then like another doctor is in there, because the baby is kind of like in distress.

So they're trying to get me to have the baby quickly.

And they're like, if you don't push the baby out, then you're going to have to have a C-section.

I was like, ugh, y'all are the worst, you know?

And so I just kind of went to a place in my mind where I was just like, okay, I've got, I know that babies come down, not when you're stressed and screaming and all the things, but when you're relaxed.

And can try to be peaceful.

And so that's what I did.

And I just was like, Lord, you know I'm terrified of needles.

I do not want to have a C-section.

Please let the baby be okay.

And I did, now that one, I had to actually do some work.

Oh, yeah.

Well, the big babies, yes.

I had to put some work in.

And it was a little bit, to me it felt like a really long time.

Yeah.

But I think it was maybe like half an hour or an hour.

Well, but I mean, after just like the first couple just coming right on out, and that does feel like a long time.

Yeah.

So I was feeling kind of like, this is intense, but he was healthy and nice and big, and he was 8'4, which I know a lot of people have babies way bigger than that.

But for such a small, I'm a very small one.

Small and short, and so that was a big baby for me.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, and compared to six pounds, I mean, that's two pounds bigger.

It adds a lot.

During the pushing especially.

And so I just remember he was bigger, but he slept like wonderful.

Oh, the bigger babies do.

Yes.

Well, okay.

Sometimes, baby.

Sometimes, let's say that.

Yeah.

Because he did.

He slept so nice, and I remember he slept on his back with his hands.

Hands by his head.

Hands by his head.

My daughter did that too.

They both slept like that.

Where my first born, you know, they say don't put your baby on your tummy, on the tummy.

They only say that now, but they didn't use to.

Back in the 80s, we were often on our bellies.

And so that's what I did, and I would just pray and say, Lord, the baby wants to sleep on its belly.

So please protect the baby, and I put the baby on the belly.

You know, that's just what I did.

Hey, my first two were both belly sleepers as well.

Yeah.

I just think the baby really determines.

I had two bellies, one back, and one side sleeper.

My fourth one would only sleep on his side.

That is interesting.

Not his back or his belly.

Just on his side, all curled up.

I love that.

That's precious.

Yeah.

His fifth one's to be determined.

We're still figuring out what his favorite positions are.

What his position is.

And so, yeah, he slept great.

He ate.

It was definitely an adjustment, like, within our family, just with all the kids and all the things.

And feeding all the people.

Feeding everybody, changing everybody.

Yes.

I thought diapers would never end.

Oh, I'm there right now.

I don't think diapers will ever end.

But that's okay, because they're cute little babies.

Yes.

So you had a three-year-old, a 20-month-old, and a newborn.

Yes.

That sounds like fun time.

Yes.

We did that.

And, you know, I have so much, like, empathy when I see women, you know, with the young kids.

I've been there.

I've been there.

Yes, you're doing a great job.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

You're alive and you made it out.

Yes.

You made it out of the house.

You made it out of the house.

So you're doing a great job.

That's right.

That's right.

And, you know, I feel like I was very particular about the first one.

I remember I would, like, write down these meticulous notes about...

Oh, yeah.

You know, if he was with, like, a grandparent or a friend or meticulous notes about what he eats and all the things.

Me too, me too.

Yes.

And by the third one, I was like, come and eat these Cheerios off the ottoman.

And the babysitter walks in, and you're walking out at the same time and being like...

Yes, that's right.

I have my phone if you need something.

Yep, that's right.

That's right.

Mm-hmm.

I was the same way.

Yes.

Pages of notes for the first one.

Yes.

Everything was labeled and put everywhere.

And then, yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Now, it's like if my mom or my sister or someone comes over to keep the kids, I'm just like, okay, let me know if you need anything.

See you later.

Well, also, my kids are old enough now that the older ones can tell them what to do.

What the routines are, so that's nice.

Okay.

So, you have three, three and under.

And for me, that's like the hardest time.

So, when all of your kids are little, so you don't have like any really older kids to even help balance that out.

It's just like they're all little and they're all needy and they all need you.

How, like, what was your faith like?

Your mental state like?

What was your, physically, I'm sure you were exhausted, but how were you emotionally, spiritually like during that time?

I feel like what kept me sane was I feel like I needed that time in the morning.

So, I was, I'm a morning person generally.

And then I feel like the Lord prepared me graciously to be a baker by keeping me up in the night.

You know, the midnight, the two o'clock kind of times.

And so, yeah, I would just use the time like in the early morning, like before I knew the kids were like really getting up after that last like nighttime feeding.

And just read the Bible or do a little study or listen to worship music or take a bath or whatever.

Sometimes me and my sister, because she had a baby same age, her second one too, her first, my second.

And we would just talk on the phone and be like, okay, we can do it.

We got this.

You know, the Lord really has called us to be moms and gave us these specific children.

So, you know, what's that going to look like?

But I really, when they were little, I stayed in the word, in the morning.

That's what I did, because I'm not a nighttime person.

Hey, the morning's the, okay, I don't want to say the morning's the best time to do it.

The morning is a great time to do it, to kind of like set that tone for the day.

But I also know in that season, it can be hard to get yourself up when you've been up, you know, throughout the night as well.

So sometimes, like even now, I'm in the newborn season currently, and it's like my Bible reading usually is not going to happen at, you know, six or seven or eight o'clock in the morning or before the kids are up.

Also, we have a three-year-old, four-year-old.

Gosh, he is four.

A four-year-old who likes to get up, you know, at five.

And so it's just like, no, I'm not getting up at 430 to like, you know, especially when I just got the baby back to sleep and whatnot.

So it'll be more like, oh, baby's napping and the kids are doing their school and every, okay, here's my, here's a good chance.

Like, and it might only last, you know, five minutes or 15 minutes or something.

Like, but it is like a moment of like just taking a breath and getting fed, you know, spiritually.

And I would spend a lot of time like, at that time, I had like a California king size bed that was given to me.

So, you know, it was me and Michael for a while.

So, you know, he would get in the bed with me like in the morning time because my husband would be off working.

And so we would just, you know, lay in the bed and he would sleep there, right?

A lot longer than he would in his own crib.

Yeah.

So that was great.

Yeah.

And I just remember, yeah, I did things like mops when they were little.

And that was wonderful because it wasn't every week.

So it was every other week.

And so that was just enough.

And for those of you who don't know what mops is, it's Moms of Preschoolers.

So where it's just, you know, there's pretty much a mops in like every city now at this point.

So if you just search, if you're interested in that and you search like your local mops group, I'm sure there's one you can sign up for if you want.

And then you got pregnant again.

So how old were your first three when you got pregnant with your last one, with the fourth?

That's a great, excellent question.

Okay, let's just say they were like four, two and new.

Yeah.

Because the first one was there two years apart, and then the middle two are 18 months.

And then the last one is two years.

So he was probably a year.

Like a little over a year before.

A little over a year.

Yeah.

And we had been married five years.

So we were like seasoned, right?

And we went to Alaska.

We went on a cruise to Alaska.

That's so cool.

Yes.

And it's a beautiful place.

And wonderful.

And that is where the last one came from.

Yes, the boat was called Norwegian Jewel.

We were like, oh.

So what did you name the fourth child?

So I was like, no, we can't name him that.

But yeah, so that's where he popped in there.

That's where he came into the picture.

Yeah, he came into the picture.

Oh, that's so funny.

Yes.

And I knew I was pregnant straight away.

I was just like, okay, here we go.

And it was good.

I mean, the kids were still so little, so they really didn't understand what all was taking place.

I mean, they knew when the baby arrived that they didn't want it there.

You know what I mean?

Right.

They knew that Mom's giving you attention instead of me.

So there was some of that.

And actually, my third was completely potty trained and everything.

Before your fourth?

Before I had the fourth.

I need to know all of your secrets.

Yes.

And then when I had the fourth one, he obviously did not like it, and he regressed.

Yeah, he did.

And so that was a struggle.

I was on the struggle bus with that.

Newborn and someone peeing their pants all the time.

Yes, and all the laundry that you have and stuff, yeah.

But that pregnancy, the fourth one, was great.

I didn't have any trouble with that one.

And then when he was born on time, like due 40 weeks, and it was like, okay, here we go.

And I remember it was a Sunday.

My parents were in town for that occasion.

And we had gone to church, and we had had KFC for lunch.

And I thought about that.

I was like, you know, if you're having contractions, you probably shouldn't have KFC.

But I did.

And so I started having contractions, and I was like, oh, okay, I'm going into labor.

I need to run.

And the baby was head down, everything great.

But I was like, let me run to, not run, go to the Dollar General to pick up a couple of things, because I know I'm going to be not here, you know?

So I...

Last-minute nesting.

Yeah, last-minute kind of things.

And I felt a lot of movement, you know, in my stomach.

But I didn't really think much of it.

So I started having contractions.

I was like, okay, we need to get to the hospital.

I had a doula who was a believer.

She was wonderful.

And by this point, they were saying, you can have water births.

Oh, at the hospital.

With your midwife.

Yes, with the midwife.

And so that was my plan, okay?

And I was like, I'm going to be fully present mentally.

I'm going to be engaged.

I'm going to look.

I'm going to do all the things.

Yeah.

I was like, because I haven't seen any of my babies be born.

Right, your eyes are closed.

Yes, my eyes are closed shut.

And so I was like, I want the mirror.

I want to see.

I want to hold the baby.

I want all of the things.

And so I get to the hospital.

It was me, my husband.

The doula was writing separate.

I think that's all we were having, because I have so many children now.

I need all of my friends to be watching them.

Taking care of them.

Oh, no, my mom was there.

So I probably had my friends at the house.

Because my mom was there with me, praise God.

And I was ready for her to be there.

So I wasn't ready before, but I felt like I was ready now.

And I get to the hospital.

I'm trying to check in at the desk.

And I had to stop, because my contractions were just really strong.

They're talking to each other.

They're like, okay, this is her fourth baby.

She probably needs a room.

We could probably skip all this stuff.

And so my midwife comes down, Vicki.

They take me right to the room.

So we just start walking.

She's like, do you think you can walk?

And I was like, I think I can walk.

And I can't get there.

Like, I'm having to keep stop.

Because every time you walk, you have a contraction.

Yes, really strong.

And then by the time we got to the room, I was feeling like I needed to push.

And I was like, I told the midwife, I said, I feel like I need to push, but I don't feel the weight with it.

Like the bearing down.

Yeah, the pressure.

And so that was really weird.

She said, OK, let me check you.

So I just stood up, and she checked me.

And she was like, OK, you're 10 centimeters, but the baby's head is not there.

So they did fill, and he was a breach.

Oh, he flipped last minute.

He flipped at the last minute.

So was he smaller, I guess, than your last one?

He ended up being in the seven pound range, but smaller than the last.

But so, and of course, as a person who's terrified of needles, and a C-section was like my worst thing ever, and I'm like, no, I'm planning to have a water birth today.

I will be pushing this baby out in the water.

Yes, I will be pushing the baby out.

And so, they had all the doctors, and everybody's coming in, and they're like, well, we can, you can either have, go ahead and have the C-section, or we can manually turn the baby.

So I said, well, sure, let's try to manually turn the baby.

I'm fine with that.

Oh, that doesn't sound comfortable.

So you have your contractions, right?

Then you have about two to three doctors in between pushing, one pushing the head, one pushing the butt to put, to move the baby.

And that is the most horrible thing that I've probably experienced.

Because of course, I'm also unmedicated.

Yeah.

So you're feeling all the things.

I'm feeling all the things.

And so they pushed the baby around.

We got pretty far, but we only got to, like, right before, like, here.

Uh-huh, on your hip.

And then he wouldn't go anymore.

And so they said, well, the baby's in distress at this point.

And being pushed all around.

Yes.

Yeah.

And so you're going to have to have an emergency C-section.

And I just about lost it.

I bet.

Emergency, emergency?

Yes.

Did you like, did you go under general anesthesia?

Like, were you awake or were you asleep?

I was conscious.

For some of it.

So I think I was awake, but I think it was very traumatic to where I either passed out or something.

Or you have mentally blocked it out of your mind.

Or I've mentally blocked it out of my mind, right.

So then they had you sign all the papers, or had me sign the papers, shaved me.

And whisked me away.

This is in like under five minutes, you know.

It moves very quickly.

And my spouse, who I've mentioned, cannot handle the things.

Did he choose not to go in with you?

So he either had, was about to pass out or something.

This is probably, you know, this is the third pregnancy that where he's like going to be passing out.

Yeah.

So I go in there and I'm by myself for a while.

Did your mom get to come in?

But then my mom, they're like, mom's here.

On my most horrifying day, my mom's here.

And actually the thing that I thought was so scary, you know, I guess them putting the needle in my back, don't even remember it.

Because you're just, I think you're just in shock.

And I was, so I was having the C-section.

And I just remember people have always told me with C-sections, oh, it's the best thing.

You just can have your baby and da-da-da-da-da.

And so I'm thinking this is easy and okay.

This is what needs to happen.

Fine, you know.

And in terms of like what I was thinking mentally like with the Lord, I just was like, Lord, I did wonder why is this happening?

You know, I had a plan.

I did all the things right, you know.

And my mom was right there by my head.

She never said it's going to be okay or you're going to be fine or whatever.

She was just praying and kind of silent really.

But I could feel while they were doing the C-section, I could feel that it was not going okay.

And my doctor, I heard them really being frustrated, like making these heaving kind of sounds, like, oh, oh, you know.

And I was like, what is happening?

Because at this point, you hadn't heard your baby yet?

No.

No.

So they're doing all that.

I'm still having contractions.

But you can't feel them anymore.

No.

And I felt like the anesthesia or whatever they gave me, a spinal or whatever, was up far.

It was like hitting me up here.

So I felt like, but then I also could feel like life, just like leaving my body.

And so I'm just like, okay, some things are not.

In my mind, I'm just, okay, things are not going well.

And so I didn't hear the baby or anything.

And what I've been told, and then I think at that point, it's probably where I passed out.

But what I've been told is he was not breathing.

The cord, I guess, was wrapped around his neck a lot of times, probably from them pushing.

So then they resuscitated him.

And I've been told I lost a lot of blood, and they wanted me to have a blood transfusion.

And I knew I wasn't on board with that.

I might be drugged up with a lot of drugs, but I know I don't want a blood transfusion.

But they said, no, you could opt to do it naturally with the foods you eat.

Bring it up.

And that's all my mother needed to hear.

She was like, oh, we will.

Right, yes.

And she did.

So that was a hard time.

He had some issues, which I really don't remember all of, just because I don't know if they gave me medicine.

I don't know, but I don't have a lot of memories.

I just remember waking up, and I was in the recovery room.

Nobody's in there.

You're by yourself?

Yes.

And I was like, where is the baby?

Where is my mother?

Where is the doula?

Where is my husband?

They don't let doulas back there.

Yeah, nobody was there.

And then finally the nurse came, and was like, hey.

And they had the things on my legs for circulation.

And actually, I didn't get to see the baby until probably at least two days later, like a day or two later.

Really?

Was he in the NICU?

Yeah.

Oh.

Yeah.

So eventually, I remember one time, they were like, okay, we're going to take you to see the baby.

And I was in the bathroom, brushing my teeth, and when I opened my eyes again, like someone's holding me.

And they've got like the smelling things happening.

The smelling salts.

Yes.

So I passed out again.

So they said, no, you can't go.

And so, you know, it was just very traumatic, heartbreaking, all the things.

I don't think I still saw my doula.

I think she probably left at that point.

You know what I mean?

Well, yeah, because when she can't go back for a C-section, but typically, I don't know, whenever I've had a client have to have a C-section, it depends on the circumstance.

Sometimes I'll stay through the whole thing and just wait, because you can't go in most of the time.

And then other times, like, I'll leave for a while, because I know I won't be able to see them for several hours.

And then, like, I'll come back when they're in their regular, like, mother and baby room that they're going to be in, and then I come back.

Mm.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, postpartum was hard.

I bet that impacted it.

Because then, were you pumping those two days then?

Uh, yeah, they had me pumping.

Mm-hmm.

Okay.

So a lot of pumping.

And, um...

Did he go on to nurse, okay?

He did.

He did go on to nurse.

And he's, you know, healthy and all the things.

Postpartum was definitely a challenge.

Because I think I was just, like, trying to deal with, like, all the things that transpired.

Mm-hmm.

You know, my mom thought that she was gonna lose her daughter, you know?

So, and she will still burst into tears, like, to this day.

Like, yeah.

Thinking about it, yeah.

Well, and for you, like, did you...

Okay, did you know that that was gonna be your last baby?

Yes.

Yes.

So, that's also...

Yes.

So, I did opt to have my tubes tied.

Oh, during the surgery?

Yes.

So, prior to, I, you know, made the decision.

Mm-hmm.

Because, actually, I had it scheduled for...

After.

I was gonna have it after.

And they were like, well, we're in here, so...

Yes.

Yes.

Because I was like, wow, I'm super fertile.

Thank you, Lord.

Thank you, Lord.

But I feel like it just progressively was getting, like...

Harder.

Harder.

I feel like if I had to do it over again, I would have probably not gotten the tubule.

Mm-hmm.

Because I feel like after my youngest was, like, three, I felt like I was, like, in a better place.

Yeah.

You know.

Because, you know, I always wanted a big family and all that.

But my family is still pretty big.

Poor kids need to get them out.

Yes.

Yes.

Okay, so that's nine years ago now that that happened.

Do you feel like you've been able to process that?

Because that's hard going into the birth, thinking you're going to have this supernatural, beautiful water birth, and then turn around.

Instead, you have, like, a complicated, urgent C-section, where things don't really go smoothly, even in the C-section.

Like, have you been able to work through all of that?

Yeah, I've gone to counseling, and that helped a lot.

With just processing, you know, what were my expectations compared to, like, reality.

And, you know, and then also having the tubal has all of its side effects and things.

But I feel like I did process it appropriately, just with the Lord, just...

And you're not going to get, you know, all of your questions answered, you know?

Sometimes you're not going to get that.

Yeah.

But it's just like, okay, Lord, what do you want to show me?

Like, through this whole process.

Ultimately, it's trusting Him, you know what I mean?

It's putting your life into His hands.

And He has it under control.

Because I am a control freak.

And so, really all the children and everything that I've experienced has helped me to realize, okay, I'm not in control.

And, you know, I want to trust the Lord, and I want to be on His plan.

Yeah.

And His plan is the best plan.

And so, yeah.

That's how I feel.

I really resonate with that.

The control, His plan, the trusting.

It's all things that I have continuously struggled with.

That's why I'm so glad that we have Sisters in Christ that we can talk to about that, too.

That you're not the only one struggling with that, and it's encouraging.

Circling back to your C-section, you asked about my input.

My only thought is I've learned a lot more in the last couple of years about breech birth, breech vaginal birth.

And which I knew very little nine years ago, but now a lot of what I'll say just from research and from learning is that a lot of times when a baby is trying to be born breech, it's because that's the position they need to be in in order to safely come out vaginally.

And there are times when you can turn a breech baby and it works.

I'm not saying that's every time, but I've just heard case after case where when you said he was doing fine, and then they tried to turn him, and then suddenly he's in distress, and it's possible that something with the cord happened during the turning.

Or I've heard stories of where babies are trying to be born breach, and then the baby comes out, and they realize that if had the baby been head down, the cord position would have been too far away, and it would have caused a placental abruption because it would have been tugging in the wrong position.

So babies, generally speaking, know how they want to be born.

Their bodies know.

And breach is really just a variation of normal.

It's not what happens the majority of the time, but it's not impossible.

People have been delivering breach for a long time.

So again, this was nine years ago.

So it was almost a decade ago.

And you didn't have any time to process that.

It was like in the moment you found out, and you're in the middle of a hospital with policies in place and providers who aren't credentialed to deliver vaginally, especially in the hospital.

So all that being said, for those of you in 2023 who might be having a breach situation, there are providers out there who are willing to deliver breach babies vaginally.

They are few and far between because they no longer teach breach in medical school, but they just teach C-sections now to OB-GYNs anyways, midwives, especially home birth midwives, will still practice breach birth.

But there's actually a cool doctor, and if you're in the birth world, you know his name.

His name is Dr.

Stu, and he's an OB-GYN, and he goes around the country teaching midwives how to deliver breach babies.

Because it's like a lost art.

It's like, well, how else did they come out before C-sections?

They did.

They just came out that way.

So his whole thing is called reteach breach, and he goes around teaching those.

So I have a dream of going to one of his workshops one day, but I'm not actually a midwife.

So I could still go if I just pay to go.

But I follow him on Instagram and stuff, and it's always fascinating to me the more I learn about breach.

Yeah, so do not be discouraged, those of you pregnant in the year 20.

Well, I guess this is going to play in 2024, but there is still hope if you want.

But if you want a C-section, then by all means, there are plenty of people willing to give you one.

So all right, Travita.

That aside, is there anything else that you want to share?

Anything from your experiences?

I mean, you got a lot of hindsight now, because we're nine years past your youngest.

So any last thoughts?

I think that it's important.

Sometimes when doctors do the same thing every day, and they had however many C-sections today or whatever, I think sometimes that they forget that, well, I've never had a C-section, so I don't know all the things that you're supposed to do or not to do.

And so, because when you have the C-section, at least back then, they would cover your stitch with stuff.

I don't even know what to call it.

Tape, maybe?

Some kind of tape?

Like a sterile strip?

Yeah, that, and then something on top of that so that you can take showers and stuff.

So that freaked me out, because I was like, I don't know what to do about that.

And then with the colangs, they gave it to me, but then they didn't tell me when to stop taking it, or like, if your stool looks like X, stop taking it.

Then you don't need it anymore, or reduce your tape.

So I took it, and then I had diarrhea and stuff.

Like, terrible.

And then it was like no more diarrhea, but just the urge, you know?

Yeah, and so that was terrible.

I'm so grateful for traveling lactation people, traveling nurses that will come to your house.

And so I've had that over the years.

And that time when I had a C-section specifically, I had a couple people come to the house, and I could ask them my questions too.

Like, what is happening?

Like, the doctor did not tell me any of this, you know, after you have the C-section.

So I think that's very important, just being informed about your choices.

Because I think there are choices available.

Yeah, I watched a lot of documentaries.

No, no, no, no, like back then.

Yeah, I used to watch, like, documentaries.

I know, I've watched bad ones, like TLC, bad ones.

But then I've watched Ricky Lake stuff.

Oh, The Business of Being Born.

Yes.

That's a great one.

If you haven't watched it, that's the first step.

Go watch The Business of Being Born.

Yes, and I think that was really the first time that opened my eyes to, oh, you know, I have choices, and I don't have to, like, fall into this, like...

Just go through the system.

The steps, yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

A lot of people don't realize that until they watch that.

I mean, I honestly didn't realize that either, and I remember when I told my, um, one of my friends that I was thinking about being a doula, she said, okay, you need to go watch The Business of Being Born.

Uh-huh.

And I was like, okay, because I didn't watch it before my first.

Um, so it was...

It's very eye-opening.

And I always encourage people to watch it if they're pregnant or planning on getting pregnant.

Even if they've had a baby before, if they haven't seen it, I highly encourage them to watch it.

It's considered old now, but I will say...

Because I think it was, like, 2004, maybe?

2004, 2000?

Yeah, somewhere in there.

Somewhere in the early 2000s.

And so with all of that, it's almost 20 years later, but everything in that documentary is even more true today than it was back then.

Like, it's so much more exemplified now.

Like, if you thought it was bad in that documentary, like, it's so much worse now.

So it's definitely worth watching, for sure.

Well, thank you.

Thank you for coming on.

Thank you for sharing.

Thank you so much for having me.

Thanks again for joining us today.

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